1345 replies to this topic

[Fyxe]

Thank Primus for that. We don't need second rate filler villains in this game.

Vaati > j00.

Dude, that's just plain harsh. Luigi and Mario are very similiar in Melee; you'd have to have each quite a lot to really feel the true differences, as it is not that noticable otherwise (with the exception of one or two moves, but when everything else feels the same it isn't enough to make one label the character as seperate). Thus, it's more than fair to group Mario, Luigi, and Dr. Mario as similar characters.

S'nawt true though... While Dr. Mario is essentially a slower, more powerful version of Mario with a few variations here and there, Luigi is extremely different. His movement is odd, very slow in the air, sliding on the ground... His ground-based attacks are generally weak compared to Mario's, his Smash attacks behave quite differently (his weird 'hand poke' for instance which gets entirely different results from Mario's attacks), while his aerial attacks are a thousand times more powerful than Mario's, making Luigi having a very different play style to Mario altogether.

Plus there's quite a few variations in timing and range for virtually every attack, and obviously the special attacks all behave rather different. Now, I'm not saying that there aren't similarities, of course there are, but compared to how it was in the original game, Luigi is heavily changed and anyone using Mario's fighting style as Luigi will get slaughtered, because you need to focus on aerial moves.

This is unlike other clone characters, where for the most part you can use the same tactics as the standard character.

As for people talking about Zero Suit Samus and Sheik... I would not be surprised if ZSS has some very similar moves to Sheik, we've actually seen a couple already that look very very similar.

[Veteran]

Vaati's a part-time no name villian from, how many, 3 games? One of which you can't play on your own, and the other two being crap?

Bowser Jr should get in ahead of Vaati and he's equally crap (sorry 15 ).

[Flint]

why do we always fight monsters and never humans?).

Um... Ganondorf anybody? XP

Also, Gerudos. And Darknuts are humans in some games, I believe. Wizzrobes might be as well...

Ganondorf is a Gerudo.

[Showsni]

And Gerudos are human.

Although Ganondorf's only a Gerudo in OoT, TWW and FSA for sure.

[Hero of Legend]

Vaati's a part-time no name villian from, how many, 3 games? One of which you can't play on your own, and the other two being crap?

More like one of them being decent and the other being great. Like, best 2D Zelda kind of great.

Yeah, I said it. And it's oh-so-true.

Although Ganondorf's only a Gerudo in OoT, TWW and FSA for sure.

And in TP, because he looks like one, wears their symbol, is said to have been the leader of the 'demon thieves' (like in ALttP), and was stated by Aonuma to be OoT Ganondorf, which is kinda obvious in the game anyway.

Edited by Hero of Legend, 25 June 2007 - 05:36 PM.

[Showsni]

Vaati's a part-time no name villian from, how many, 3 games? One of which you can't play on your own, and the other two being crap?

More like one of them being decent and the other being great. Like, best 2D Zelda kind of great.

Yeah, I said it. And it's oh-so-true.

Although Ganondorf's only a Gerudo in OoT, TWW and FSA for sure.

And in TP, because he looks like one, wears their symbol, is said to have been the leader of the 'demon thieves' (like in ALttP), and was stated by Aonuma to be OoT Ganondorf, which is kinda obvious in the game anyway.

FSA is the best 2D Zelda???
Yeah, TP too. Oops.

[Alardonin]

And Gerudos are human.

Although Ganondorf's only a Gerudo in OoT, TWW and FSA for sure.

Well we could talk about some influence and or some humans present in other Zelda games, but are Gerudos human in OOT? I mean... with the whole magical blood(or whatever you want to call it) that makes them all female, with the exception to the rule.. I wouldn't really call them human. Even if the difference is mostly insignificant.

[Fyxe]

Vaati's a part-time no name villian from, how many, 3 games? One of which you can't play on your own, and the other two being crap?

Minish Cap is not crap. At all. It's a great game. Nor is FSA, actually, although it's not as good as other Zeldas, it's spiffingly fun in multiplayer (and quite good single player, actually).

No name villian? Noooo, his name's 'Vaati'. Vaaaaati.

Bowser Jr should get in ahead of Vaati and he's equally crap (sorry 15 ).

Oh come on, at least Vaati is vaguely original, Bowser Jr. is just a knockoff of Baby Bowser with an annoying voice.

Vaati is a good villian. He is.

Anyway, on the Gerudo topic, I know Ganon's a Gerudo, I was just pointing out that Link fights Gerudos seperately from Ganondorf as an example of the humans he fights. And Alardonin, if you're going to call a Gerudo non-human, then what about Hylians? C'mon, a human is a human, Hylians and Gerudos are just different races. Gerudos breed with Hylians, so they're just a different breed of human.

Lets not have a whole Zelda Storyline style discussion here. o.o

Edited by Fyxe, 25 June 2007 - 06:17 PM.

[Hero of Legend]

FSA is the best 2D Zelda???

No... TMC is. I just love that game. ALttP is a close second, though.

And for the record, Ganondorf was stated to be a human in FSA, and he was a Gerudo in that game.

[Showsni]

Don't worry, just teasing you. Though FSA's not bad, really. It's a game I can play with my younger brother very easily. Though having to have GBAs is a bit of a hassle.

[Alardonin]

And Alardonin, if you're going to call a Gerudo non-human, then what about Hylians? C'mon, a human is a human, Hylians and Gerudos are just different races. Gerudos breed with Hylians, so they're just a different breed of human.

Lets not have a whole Zelda Storyline style discussion here. o.o

Well they are definitely Humanoids... so in a sense you're right. In any case on topic.... Hmm..... Zelda looks awsome! And the Starfox stage as well... The updates are coming rather nicely. All I want now... is... Online features!

[31-Year-Old-From-Georgia]

Oh, yeah, Vet and Fyxe? Well, Bowser Jr. > j00.

;P

Zelda's face here is very... scary and unemotional. The hair, dress, and sparkly effects are good, but her face looks like that of a snake woman.

Also, that Star Fox comic is one the best of all of VGCats.

[Kazi]

Hey guys, take your fantasy race wank derail back to the Zelda forum.

Zelda's dark hair and stern face makes her way too generic and entirely forgettable. I wholly prefer the Wind Waker version.

PS Pikachu.

[DarkJuno]

The guy's got a sub-series, man! That's more than you have!

False.

Whatever the case, no one's changing their mind about what's-his-face at this point so drop it, or leave it for the Zelda forum goers to argue over.

Anyway, Zelda started off with brown hair, she only became blonde in OoT and some of the games afterwards. The fact that she lacks her TP sword here makes me wonder if they really did drop Sheik though - I'd like to see a TP stylized version of her myself.

As for her (lack of) emotion, given her general attitude and state-of-mind in TP, and her lack of facial expression anyway in Melee except when she gets hit, it's not that different. I'll just wait fo her idle pose where she flips her hair and messes with those...roll things.

[Hero of Legend]

False.

I was talking more about, you know, real games.

Not that any of this was very serious to begin with. Or that this topic was much more derailed than usual for that matter.

Anyway, Zelda started off with brown hair, she only became blonde in OoT and some of the games afterwards.

Actually, Zelda's hair was red in the originals, not brown. And she had yellow hair in the ALttP art. Then orange in OoT. Then yellow in TWW. Then dirty orange in TP.

And frankly, no SSB character has ever had any real emotional expressions. What makes, say, Mario better than Zelda? Nothing, really. He certainly doesn't make any facial expressions or anything. I guess the original design is to blame here - I for one never liked how the characters' eyes were drawn in TP.

Edited by Hero of Legend, 25 June 2007 - 11:22 PM.

[DarkJuno]

False.

I was talking more about, you know, real games.

You weren't specific enough. So meh.

And it doesn't aprticularly matter what color hair she has anyway - she's recognizable as Zelda, so that's enough.

[Kazi]

http://www.smashbros...ic/music04.html

Wow, an insightful Japan Time. Who would have guessed?

[Fyxe]

Wow, an insightful Japan Time. Who would have guessed?

What does that even mean? o.o

[DarkJuno]

That's a pretty sweet arrangement. Samples could be better, but they're decent enough.

[Kazi]

What does that even mean? o.o

It means that smashbros.com actually updated with something we didn't know.

[Fyxe]

So far there's been a bunch of new things we didn't know. I don't see how this music in particular is more new than anything else. Now, Zelda's addition would possibly classify, as it's the only major character information for awhile (aside from Pit's moves and the Final Smashes).

I really adore this new medley. It sounds retro yet fresh at the same time, which I guess is what they're going for. It's clever how they make some of the tweeist tunes in the game (the Ocarina tunes) sound dramatic, as well.

As a side note, the composer this time around is the composer for the Wild Arms series.

Edited by Fyxe, 26 June 2007 - 04:23 PM.

[Showsni]

Sounds pretty good. Not as good as some Zelda songs, but infintely better than the Donkey Konga version of the Zelda theme...

So it goes:
Song of Storms, Epona's Song, Song of Time, Saria's Song, Zelda's Lullaby?
I.e. the non-warping songs from OoT, less the Sun's Song.

[Chaltab]

I really don't like how dark Zelda's hair is in this game--or how bright Samus' is, especially by contrast. I think they should trade hair colors. (Anyone else miss the days when Samus had purple hair back in those Nintendo Power Super Metroid Comics?)

Edited by Chaltab, 26 June 2007 - 05:13 PM.

[D~N]

*hi-fives Chaltab* I agree with the purple hair! However, Zelda's hair, too me, looks best as a dirty blonde/brown, so I'm liking the new one. Still, Samus with purple hair would own.

Don't forget alternate costumes! It's totally possible.

This Zelda medley is outstanding. My guess is that there are more Ocarina songs in it, and it's likely that they are cut off in the beginning and end. It's almost a given that there are at least one or two more, considering how the songs fades in and out...

[Flint]

Hey guys, take your fantasy race wank derail back to the Zelda forum.

Zelda's dark hair and stern face makes her way too generic and entirely forgettable. I wholly prefer the Wind Waker version.

I like The Wind Waker's version of Zelda too, but I find it hard to believe anybody will really forget who Zelda is just because of a serious expression and dark hair.

[Kazi]

I like The Wind Waker's version of Zelda too, but I find it hard to believe anybody will really forget who Zelda is just because of a serious expression and dark hair.

I meant that her character design doesn't strike me as definitive for such an important character. I expected her to stand out a little more.

[Hero of Legend]

The Ocarina medley is very good - My favorite of the songs they've shown thus far. I've noticed they never show the entire song, which is good since it's just a tease. I also noticed the arrangements are more, uh, arranged than in Melee, where they usually settled with a simple orchestration of an old song.

I meant that her character design doesn't strike me as definitive for such an important character. I expected her to stand out a little more.

I think Zelda's design was one of the more original and memorable ones in TP, actually. They changed some things that have been true for her since the days of ALttP, and I for one thought it was for the better. Link, by comparison, is just the same as always. Not that that?s necessarily a bad thing...

Edit:

Oh yeah, today's update, the banana peel!

...Yeah, it's rather cliché.

Edited by Hero of Legend, 27 June 2007 - 05:03 AM.

[Chaltab]

Oh yeah, today's update, the banana peel!

...Yeah, it's rather cliché.

Indeed. Plus it doesn't really seem to mesh well with the typical Smash Bros item set. It jsut makes your character fall down? So what? The point of the game is to get knocked out of the arena.

[Fyxe]

So? The Flipper in Melee didn't knock people out of the arena, and nor did the Bumper in the original. Many items do more than just knock people out of the arena. The Banana would obviously leave people vulnerable for a moment or two, which is enough time for someone to give them a solid whack.

Honestly, do people actually think through things when they make little niggling complaints about EVERYTHING? Zelda's hair, a banana peel, Fox looking like his latest appearance rather than a decade old one? What next? Is Mario's hat the wrong shade of red?

Look, I'm not going to defend this game against everything, but it'd be nice that if people are going to complain all the time, they'd think their complaints through or complain about something that actually, y'know, matters.

I expect people today to be going OMG MOBILE PHONE STYLE LETTER INPUT?

Art © Josh Lesnick

Edited by Fyxe, 28 June 2007 - 07:19 AM.

[Splash]

You're being pretty darn hypocritical there, Fyxe. :3

The banana peel was both a suprising and expected addition, which is funny to me. X3 When it comes to the name input, I do wish they let you use one more letter or so in the name... then again, having the screen spammed up with names would suck. Ah, well.