181 replies to this topic

[dcLx]

There is a hell but there NO ONE has ever heard it all of the sounds are just fake

[Bond Extreme]

And that goes into one of the most controversial questions of our own culture- if a child dies before they are old enough to accept Christ and fully understand the meaning of accepting him, will that child go to hell for being an unbeliever?

No. The child will not go to hell. The child is to young to understand so the child would go to Heaven. It would not be fair if they went to hell. I'm sure a lot of us agree on that.

[31-Year-Old-From-Georgia]

No. The child will not go to hell. The child is to young to understand so the child would go to Heaven. It would not be fair if they went to hell. I'm sure a lot of us agree on that.

Yeah. but what about Delphi's scenario?

And, whoops, you're right, korhend. Pardon my... non-intellect-ness. *redundant smile*

[Korhend]

not your fault, pardon my nerdiness. Chiang's a very suitable substitute. Killed a million people to get his enemy's ankles wet, killed several hundred thousand in brutal purges. Then he became a Christian and repented for his sins.

Now heres the loophole that always gets me. If your going to heaven because you were never taught of the Lord, but if you here of the lord and reject him your going to hell...aren't you just endangering people of going to hell by telling them? It seems logical that in order for christians to save people from hell, the holy doctrine should be kept as some supreme secret.

[Delphi]

I think that if a child dies before an age of accountability, they will not go to Hell. It's my belief and the belief of my religion that this age is eight years old. Which is why Mormons are baptized at the age of eight. Of course if you join later or like in adulthood you can can be baptized. People who are mentally challenged are an exception to the age of accountability, though, I believe. It wouldn't be fair to them.

And could you please answer my question? We're onto another page and it still hasn't been answered. How about this, you post what you think about that and I'll post what I think?

[Nevermind]

I personally think that someone as such wouldn't be abandoned if their morality was in order. I mean, it's one thing to have never encountered Jesus, but it's still not rejecting him. So yeah, I think that if you do live to care for other people, you're on the right path. This doesn't apply to people who know about, yet reject Him, though.

[Alakhriveion]

What about people not exposed to God- if children get off easy, why shouldn't other people without appropriate opperotunity? What about, as mentioned, the evil and repentant? What about non-believers who do good? And why would someone so big on forgiveness be damning people left and right for something as small as disbelief?

[Delphi]

What about people not exposed to God- if children get off easy, why shouldn't other people without appropriate opperotunity? What about, as mentioned, the evil and repentant? What about non-believers who do good? And why would someone so big on forgiveness be damning people left and right for something as small as disbelief?

Which is why I don't believe in the traditional version of Hell. >.> I would explain, but I have to literally run to class now. *runs*

[Showsni]

Have you read The Last Battle by C.S.Lewis? In it, Aslan says that the man who worshipped Tash but in a good way counted as worshipping him... So according to C.S.Lewis Delpi's man would go to heaven. I don't know what I think myself...

[spunky-monkey]

Surely we can find a better example than the chronicles of narnia. Besides I think Lewis' lion 'Aslan' was making a mockery of God.

[arunma]

Surely we can find a better example than the chronicles of narnia. Besides I think Lewis' lion 'Aslan' was making a mockery of God.

I don't think so. Aslan isn't supposed to replace Jesus. The whole idea of the Chronicles of Narnia (and other such Christian literature) is to introduce children to a Christian worldview. That way when they read the Bible, they will have the advantage of being able to understand it properly.

[Nevermind]

And why would someone so big on forgiveness be damning people left and right for something as small as disbelief?

Because He's just as big on damning people as He is on forgiving them. You forget, He's wrathful as well as forgiving. He gives you chances, but at the end of your life, no more chances, so if you still reject Him, then you get the other face of God.

[arunma]

Or, as Alak once said himself: "God is no pansy." Besides which, we see unbelief as a really big sin.

[spunky-monkey]

So is God merciful or wrathful then?

[dcLx]

^ I'm sure he still loves them but has to send them to hell for what they have done ^

It's just like parents grounding us..for eternity

[Goose]

ITs like, he doesn't want us to make bad choices, but if we do, we have to face the consequences of those choices. Kind of sad, but real. God gives us the choice.

[Bond Extreme]

Now for the people out in 3rd world countries that can't even escape their own country. Now don't think they can't hear about the Lord. Thats why there are missionaries. My church itself has about 80 of them going out to so many countries telling people about the Lord.

[MikePetersSucks]

If God wants us to believe in his son, why doesn't he give proof to base that belief off of? I'm sorry, children, but a book does not count as evidence of anything. I want to see stigmata, I want to hear angelic choirs, the good crap from the old days. And if God had to send his son down to allow us to get into heaven, why didn't he just design it that way from the beginning? Why didn't he just cut out his son as a middleman and say "Believe in ME and you'll get into heaven?"

[Vazor]

Because people WEREN'T believing in God. At least, not in the way he wanted them to. I believe you missed the point of the entire New Testament. If you want proof, it's all around you. If you choose to be blind, that's not God's fault.

[arunma]

If God wants us to believe in his son, why doesn't he give proof to base that belief off of? I'm sorry, children, but a book does not count as evidence of anything. I want to see stigmata, I want to hear angelic choirs, the good crap from the old days. And if God had to send his son down to allow us to get into heaven, why didn't he just design it that way from the beginning? Why didn't he just cut out his son as a middleman and say "Believe in ME and you'll get into heaven?"

Two Scripture verses come to my mind. First, Jesus says, "He said to him, 'If they do not hear Moses and the Prophets, neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead.'" (St. Luke 16:31). Again he says, "An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign, but no sign will be given to it except the sign of Jonah." (St. Matthew 16:4).

The sign of Jonah is the resurrection of Christ. I would argue that if the Gospel and the church don't convince a person that Jesus is Lord, then miracles won't convince them either.

[Bond Extreme]

MPS your answers lie in the bible. The bible will give you proof.

[MikePetersSucks]

How does the Bible give proof? I've read the thing repeatedly, went to bible studies, and consulted my local church. Not. A. Single. Shred. Of. Proof.

[Nevermind]

The Bible doesn't give proof. The whole foundation of Christianity is faith. He wants us to believe in Him. There is a difference between knowing and believing.

However, in my opinion the bible offers just as much proof as evolution theories do. See, you've got fossils and similarities between creatures and stuff. Physical evidence. But no one was THERE. No one can be absolutely sure, just logical. Then you've got unexplained happenings, inherent feelings, emotions, mindsets that run far deeper than that of any other creature. Still....again, no one can be absolutely sure, just faithful.

[Doopliss]

You know, we've also got physics and phsychology.

[Alakhriveion]

However, in my opinion the bible offers just as much proof as evolution theories do. See, you've got fossils and similarities between creatures and stuff. Physical evidence. But no one was THERE.

We're ALL there RIGHT NOW.

No one can be absolutely sure, just logical.

Surely you admit that logic trumps a questionable interperatation of the mistranslated creation myths of desert nomads.

Then you've got unexplained happenings, inherent feelings, emotions, mindsets that run far deeper than that of any other creature.

Show me an "unexplained happening." Show me an emotion that can't be explained. I won't even ask you do show how our minds are trancendant because five minutes of television will show you we're just monkeys that think very highly of ourselves.

Still....again, no one can be absolutely sure, just faithful.

And that's still not true.

[Nevermind]

Okay, using your own body, prove to me that you originated from a single-celled organism.

Using physics and logic, show me why humans beings are the only creatures that use creativity to express themselves for more than just dominance, or the process of mating.

Using psychology, explain deja vu. I know it's not religious based, but as far as I'm aware it still remains in the "unexplained".

If logic is the be-all-end-all of this world, then why are there illogical things in existence?

Why do humans wonder about their origins, their purpose, or the reason for life in the first place? I'm sure physics can explain that pretty easily. Can't it?

A male lion, upon taking over a pride, will kill all cubs that are not from his own line. Why would a person run into a burning house to save a child they've never met?

There's millions of instances of emotions taking over that cannot be put into logic when compared against every other creature on this earth. Why then, are humans so different if there is nothing deeper inside of us? Where do ethics, and moral values come from? Guilt? Revenge? Justice?

[spunky-monkey]

Logic and all of Creation don't mix, so there's no point trying.

I don't know about the rest of you but Hell is a stain on creation, can any of you ever hope to enjoy Heaven, in the knowledge that billions of people are suffering elsewhere at the same time? I know I couldn't...
The entire Universe will most likely have to be destroyed and started all over again...at our expense of course.

[Bond Extreme]

I don't want this turning into an evolution topic.

And I'm absolutly sure that God exists and the bible is very true.

[Alakhriveion]

[quote name='Lazurukeel]Okay' date=' using your own body, prove to me that you originated from a single-celled organism.[/quote'] No. What does that have to do with anything?

[quote]Using physics and logic, show me why humans beings are the only creatures that use creativity to express themselves for more than just dominance, or the process of mating.[/quote]Who says we do? Who says everything else does?

[quote]Using psychology, explain deja vu. I know it's not religious based, but as far as I'm aware it still remains in the "unexplained".[/quote] "Woah, man, I think I've been here doing this before... OK, it's gone" is not science. Creepy feelin' is easily explained.

[quote]If logic is the be-all-end-all of this world, then why are there illogical things in existence?[/quote]Like what? Babel Fish?[/quote]Why do humans wonder about their origins, their purpose, or the reason for life in the first place? I'm sure physics can explain that pretty easily. Can't it?[/quote]No, in fact, it has absolutely nothing to do with two of the three. Chemistry won't tell me anything about sentance structure, so why haven't we given up on THAT?

[quote]A male lion, upon taking over a pride, will kill all cubs that are not from his own line. Why would a person run into a burning house to save a child they've never met?[/quote]Because we're not lions. This makes niether of a special.

[quote]There's millions of instances of emotions taking over that cannot be put into logic when compared against every other creature on this earth.[/quote] Like? [quote]Why then, are humans so different if there is nothing deeper inside of us?[/quote]We're really not. [quote]Where do ethics, and moral values come from? Guilt? Revenge? Justice?[/quote] Society is important to us. Evolution favors it.

[MikePetersSucks]

I don't know about the rest of you but Hell is a stain on creation, can any of you ever hope to enjoy Heaven, in the knowledge that billions of people are suffering elsewhere at the same time? I know I couldn't...

Exactly! And what if someone you loved is in Hell? OMG, how is JESUS ever happy if he loves everyone? He must cry every night knowing that his birth is the direct catalyst for millions of souls being damned forever.