200 replies to this topic

[Koji]

When I went to IGN today and I saw the picture of the controller, my first thought was that Nintendo has gone nuts. That this was it. That no matter how much I loved Nintendo, they had finally lost even me - who's defended everything from the lack of DVD and online support to the cel-shading of Wind Waker. I read the hands-on reports and felt a little more hopeful. And then I read the quotes from several third-party heads about how they were excited to try new things with this. How EA is especially eager. I became slightly more hopeful (they may have lost me, but at least they've got 3rd party support). And then I started trying to apply the controller to the gameplay mechanics of a Zelda game. And that's when it clicked. Here's my quote from the Zelda Legends Forums:

Imagine walking through a dungeon via the analog peripheral. A stalfos jumps out at you. You point the controller at the screen, click on him, thus A-targeting him, and begin swinging your arm through the air wildly, effectively slashing him to death on screen.
-OR-
Maybe it's not so physically intense. Maybe you walk into the dungeon using the controller's gyroscopic technology and when the stalfos leaps at you, you point at him, hit the button on the back (a la Z-targeting), you now have him B-targeted and you can begin hitting the A-button rapidly, slashing him to death.
-OR-
It could be a combination of the two. Where you walk into the dungeon using the analog stick, point at the Stalfos, B-target him, and slash away with the A-button. That sounds best to me. In fact - that seems like some of the most fluid gameplay I've ever heard of.

I believe that Nintendo may have actually found something here. It's bold and crazy and insane - but since when has Nintendo ever gone the straight and narrow? You're talking about the company who introduced a platformer where you use Bongo drums to move around. But you're also talking about the company who kicked off the video-game market as we know it today and introduced the rumble feature to video games and vastly improved wirelessly controlled gaming so much so that it is now the standard. They aren't completely stupid.

Besides - there's still the casing you can put the controller in that's supposed to look like a wavebird - so even if you hate the controller, you can at least swich it around a little bit.

[D~N]

*IMPORTANT* for all the winey babies, i read around IGN, and found out that they are going to mkae a more "standard and traditional" controller. hope that makes you happy

[Veteran]

But for someone like me, who doesn't want a retarded.... sorry, innovative controller; and can probably only afford one of the three new consoles, the Revolution isn't going to be for me is it?

No, I'm very much traditional. I don't want to touch a screen, I don't want to beat some bongos, and I don't want to use a remote! This is the last straw now, Nintendo are producing too much craziness and not enough "substance". I've jumped ship.

EDIT:

*IMPORTANT* for all the winey babies, i read around IGN, and found out that they are going to mkae a more "standard and traditional" controller. hope that makes you happy

Gimme link!

[GJ Skywalker]

sounds like marmite

[Koji]

I don't see why people are complaining so much. When has Nintendo ever let you down? They've gone from the top to the bottom to...somewhere over here - but they've ALWAYS delivered (I'm completely ignoring VirtualBoy and R.O.B. here). But I mean really, they come out with the craziest of things - and it always works. Somehow, it works. I don't think the gameplay designs are going to be as new as everyone here seems to think they are. My Zelda idea had regular 3D Zelda in mind. No changes. No first person. Super Smash Bros. on the Revolution? I say that moving the controller makes you jump or duck, move side to side just like the control stick on SSMB. The peripheral with the joystick could act like the C-stick. The Z1 and Z2 buttons on that same peripheral could be the shield buttons, and the A and B buttons attack. That doesn't sound so frighteningly new, now does it? Give it a chance - I bet you anything this is going to be nothing short of amazing.

Edit: And hell, even if what I'm saying doesn't happen - Nintendo's got Miyamoto. I bet you anythign he helped develope the damn thing and knows EXACTLY what he can do with it. As long as Nintendo's got him - it's gonna be okay.

[GJ Skywalker]

I wasn't complaining, I always have faith in Nintendo and in the execution of the innovations they bring to the industry (which I will not go into now)

It's just that this whole argument of 'love it, hate it or indifferent to it' thing reminds of marmite's advertising campaign.


Which not many people outside the UK know about....

[Hero of Winds]

Edit: And hell, even if what I'm saying doesn't happen - Nintendo's got Miyamoto.  I bet you anythign he helped develope the damn thing and knows EXACTLY what he can do with it.  As long as Nintendo's got him - it's gonna be okay.

Miyamoto also designed the GameCube controller. Miyamoto claimed that Super Mario Sunshine would be innovative. Miyamoto may be damn good at what he does, but he's not infallible.

Virtual Boy and R.O.B. didn't work. Don't ignore them just because they're the exceptions your "Nintendo rocks no matter what they do" rule.

I also happen to agree with Vet (to a degree). I think the controller... has potential... and I still intend on getting a Revolution, but seeing the Revolution remote controller only helped to reinforce one of the reasons why I'm getting an Xbox 360: I still want to play normal games, with a normal controller, on a normal (albeit kickass) console.

Also, like Vet, I'd like to see a link (regarding there being a standard Revolution controller) before being called a "whiney baby" just because I don't adhere to Nintendo's latest bout of insanity.

[GJ Skywalker]

Wasn't Virtual Boy invented by the late Gunpei Yokoi?

[Hero of Winds]

Wasn't Virtual Boy invented by the late Gunpei Yokoi?

Indeed it was.

Btw, found the link Dark~Nutz was talking about. Don't know how legitimate it is - you'd think something like this could from Iwata or Reggie, not from the NOE president.

[GJ Skywalker]

I'd like to reply to the link HoW but it's taking out both the forums and links page.

[Veteran]

I really don't think this will sell at all well, even if there's going to be some kind of happy medium where the controller (no doubt at an added expense) turns into a normal one.

If any casual gamers remained with Nintendo through GCN and the DS, they've certainly lost them now. Only die-hards will remain and it won't be enough.

Nintendo + that pad = Sega and/or dinosaurs.

[Koji]

Okay, R.O.B. and VirtualBoy blew terribly. In fact, they should be cast into the pits of a raging hellfire. It's true. But in the company's 20+ year history in the videogame industry - look at what they've done. They've pushed the industry in new directions. They just decided to take a bigger step this time than just shoulder buttons or rumble paks or wireless controllers. You guys keep thinking that this has suddenly changed everything. It's a controller! That's it! What've they been saying this whole time? It's going to change THE WAY YOU PLAY video games. Not the video games you play.

Bottomline - wait until you try it out. Wait until it shows up at Toys-R-Us to demo - then decide. I am of the opinion that this could be one of Nintendo's shining moments.

[GJ Skywalker]

Either way, only time will tell

[Dryth]

Nintendo's taking a pretty big risk.

From the user's standpoint I'll need to try it. I've tried a handful of fluid UI simulations in the past, and seen far more bite the dust. Every industry's entertained the notion of this concept for decades. Heck, it was the dream that motivated the likes of the Power Glove. The question is whether Nintendo's managed to tighten their own implementation enough that it actually works. Two of the most notable challenges they'll face is providing force feedback and having on-screen elements react predictably based on user actions. This has yet to be achieved in any industry, and was a problem even in the days of the lightgun and Super Scope.

To put it in perspective: It's nice to conceive of swinging a foe to vanquish enemies, but while you're making that swinging sensation with one arm, you're walking with the analog stick, and actually looking around with...? The end effect is like patting your head while rubbing your stomach.

I'm also wary of re-monetization of controller peripherals. It hurt Nintendo with the N64, having to periodically upgrade the console for the sake of one or two games. Still, we'll see what happens. The fact that we already have people talking about a second controller as a GOOD thing absolutely terrifies me.

From the market standpoint it sets Nintendo apart, and whether that's a good or a bad thing is going to be the real gamble. The PS3 will likely hold majority market share if only for the marketshare held by the PS2. The PS3 and Xbox 360 are relatively similar, power differences apart. Developers will be faced with the choice of developing games with the PS3 and Xbox 360 in mind or the Revolution in mind. It does seem to be consistent with Nintendo's practice of developing consoles with themselves in mind over their developers. Though happy developer comments so far are a plus.

The really big question on my mind is what sort of games will dominate on the system. One of the things I dislike about the DS's present and future game library is the abundance of proof-of-concept titles that tend to accompany new technology.

Despite my negativity this could be an amazing thing if done right. It's just yet to be seen whether it will. Historically there are certain areas in the industry where "innovation" has always failed.

[GJ Skywalker]

Nintendo's taking a pretty big risk.

From the user's standpoint I'll need to try it. I've tried a handful of fluid UI simulations in the past, and seen far more bite the dust. Every industry's entertained the notion of this concept for decades. Heck, it was the dream that motivated the likes of the Power Glove. The question is whether Nintendo's managed to tighten their own implementation enough that it actually works. Two of the most notable challenges they'll face is providing force feedback and having on-screen elements react predictably based on user actions. This has yet to be achieved in any industry, and was a problem even in the days of the lightgun and Super Scope.

To put it in perspective: It's nice to conceive of swinging a foe to vanquish enemies, but while you're making that swinging sensation with one arm, you're walking with the analog stick, and actually looking around with...? The end effect is like patting your head while rubbing your stomach.

I'm also wary of re-monetization of controller peripherals. It hurt Nintendo with the N64, having to periodically upgrade the console for the sake of one or two games. Still, we'll see what happens. The fact that we already have people talking about a second controller as a GOOD thing absolutely terrifies me.

From the market standpoint it sets Nintendo apart, and whether that's a good or a bad thing is going to be the real gamble. The PS3 will likely hold majority market share if only for the marketshare held by the PS2. The PS3 and Xbox 360 are relatively similar, power differences apart. Developers will be faced with the choice of developing games with the PS3 and Xbox 360 in mind or the Revolution in mind. It does seem to be consistent with Nintendo's practice of developing consoles with themselves in mind over their developers. Though happy developer comments so far are a plus.

The really big question on my mind is what sort of games will dominate on the system. One of the things I dislike about the DS's present and future game library is the abundance of proof-of-concept titles that tend to accompany new technology.

Despite my negativity this could be an amazing thing if done right. It's just yet to be seen whether it will. Historically there are certain areas in the industry where "innovation" has always failed.

Happy developer commentsare always a plus but I thought it would Nintendo's policy in all console development to have the developer in mind, so that the technology is easier to utilize and they can be more creative.

That's what I think anyway.......

[GJ Skywalker]

Really sorry to double post, I wanted to give my opinion (it was in a closed thread)

Yeah, a debate has been raging on in the 'Revolution controller rumours' forum the moment it was revealed on the net.

It is innovative, and the interctive possibilities are endless. What gets me though is that people are judging Nintendo and their decision regarding the controller by saying that their 'disappointed' and 'I won't be spending any money on this'.

The way I see it (with all due respect to the other consoles) I see another faceless FPS or RPG on th traditional set-up, but maybe this is what the industry needs right now.
Look at it this way, if Nintendo weren't here would you be tired of the gaming industry (not to take anything away from the eyetoy or other such peripherals) and the samey consoles with the samey games. And if the the Revolution's own controller isn't for you, you can still plug in the Gamecube controller for traditional play.


Don't judge a book by its cover and give it a chance.

[Hero of Winds]

I'll have to agree with Dryth (even if he just reiterated my post with a few buzz words ). I like to see Nintendo actually back up their claims of seperating themselves from the norm (i.e. Sony and Microsoft). The problem with revolutionizing the way you play games, whether it turns out to be a success or failure, is that you if stray too far off the beaten path, you alienate both the consumer and the developer.

Gamers are used to playing with a gamepad, with two analog sticks (etc). Developers are used to making games for such a setup. When you create something like the remote controller (patent pending, btw), you run the risk of alienating gamers: they've become so accustomed to the standard setup of playing games, that any change (whether good or bad) could be prove too awkward and too much of a challenge. I actually find this quite ironic, considering Nintendo went out of their way to say the Revolution's controller would be less complicated and more accessible to anybody willing to play.

The same is true for developers: because of the remote controller's specific functionalities, developers will find it increasingly difficult (read: unprofitable) for them to dedicate so much time and money on porting a pre-existing PS3/360 game to Revolution - especially if Nintendo's bad rep follows them into the next-gen, which would make multiplatform games on the Revolution unprofitable no matter what happens. So what you end up with are developers who have to split their resources between PS3/360 games and Revolution games. This is better for Nintendo fans (sort of) because it means more quality, exclusive titles and less watered down ports. However, that kind of balance is fragile: if the mainstream market rejects the Revolution's way of gameplay, third-party developers may follow suit.

Like Dryth said, Nintendo is taking a huge risk here. Granted, Nintendo wouldn't exist without making huge risks (releasing the NES after the gaming industry collapsed, the whole concept of handheld gaming, etc) but still... even though I still need to play with/see the controller in action, I think I can safely say that the Revolution has the potential to be Nintendo's last console. This could definitely make or break Nintendo's console division.

[Masamune]

This is the death of Nintendo as a console manufacturer I can proclaim without a shadow of doubt. Everyone saying this isn't the worst thing in the world, and people hoping that there's still some... well, hope: you are deluding yourselves.

Damn right it will. Just like that Nintendo DS, what kind of crap was that? Who wants two screens, anyways.

And the N64 controller? Can we say Nintendo on crack? Yes.

Keeping up a 8-bit two color system while superior stuff like Atari Lynx and Gamegear were on the market? Suicide.

Or how about their farked up home console system in a dead market? The NES was one mistake after another.

Nintendo is full of craptards who never know what they are doing.

[D~N]

^ lol.

Vet., i don't see why you don't like it. Is it because the "remote" shape? or the "two parts" of the controller? or is it the motion dectection??? I love all three of those things! so what is it? I mean, it's a risky market decision, yes, but we shouldn't care! we should care about what it is and how cool (or not) it is...so why, vet, do you hate it?

[31-Year-Old-From-Georgia]

Damn right it will. Just like that Nintendo DS, what kind of crap was that? Who wants two screens, anyways.

And the N64 controller? Can we say Nintendo on crack? Yes.

Keeping up a 8-bit two color system while superior stuff like Atari Lynx and Gamegear were on the market? Suicide.

Or how about their farked up home console system in a dead market? The NES was one mistake after another.

Nintendo is full of craptards who never know what they are doing.

Masa wins the thread. Seriously, people, don't judge it until you actually use the damned thing. >.>

IGN's mock-up is pretty sexy. Wish that was official. If Nintendo releases something along the lines of that, I'll be thrilled.

[D~N]

THANK YOU FOR FINDING THAT!!!!!!!!!

now we may all stop complaning! right....RIGHT!!!! >=I

*breaths*

btw, the controller does look prety cool...

[31-Year-Old-From-Georgia]

Dude, it's a fake. But I wish it was real.

*edits his last post to make it more clear*

[BrendantheJedi]

Masa wins the thread. Seriously, people, don't judge it until you actually use the damned thing. >.>
 
IGN's mock-up is pretty sexy. Wish that was official. If Nintendo releases something along the lines of that, I'll be thrilled.

Obviously. Hopefully the big N will probably have the foresight to launch the console with it included.

Saw the teaser trailer. God, Nintendo can make a splash. The teaser seemed so cool. Just imagine if Halo 3 could be on the system. Imagine if you will indivdually aimed duel wielding. Wouldn't it be awesome!

[Reflectionist]

what the hell!?

[D~N]

Dude, it's a fake. But I wish it was real.
 
*edits his last post to make it more clear*

i know, but it's just to show people that this Is a good idea. I just needed some proof.

[BrendantheJedi]

i know, but it's just to show people that this Is a good idea.  I just needed some proof.

It may be just a concept, but it is already confirmed that it happen.

[Dryth]

Happy developer commentsare always a plus but I thought it would Nintendo's policy in all console development to have the developer in mind, so that the technology is easier to utilize and they can be more creative.

Nintendo thinks about Nintendo first. Their old business model of charging third-parties obscene amounts in manufacturing costs has fallen apart. This only strengthens their commitment to pursuing guaranteed income streams if only to placate investors. That is, what they themselves are capable of themselves. It's also their greatest draw; I wouldn't buy a Nintendo console if not for Nintendo's own games, and I think that's true for a lot of us.

And the N64 controller? Can we say Nintendo on crack? Yes.

And surely the Revolution have as great an impact on Nintendo's marketshare as the N64, if not more!

[Masamune]

The N64 was my poorest example, but the controller was not. It had a great impact on the future of controllers.

[Dryth]

Along with its ups it also had its serious downs, though. Most relevant is probably the monetization of accessories followed by incredibly inconsistent support. Memory cards were the worst offenders, but even the rumble pack ended up being treated more like a novelty by developers than a practical compliment to the gaming experience. And whoever came up with the three-position idea should be shot.

If anything the N64 controller reflected a lot of good ideas and a handful of critical bad ideas that took another generation to resolve. It would truly be a shame if the same takes place this coming generation.

[Green Goblin]

didn't Rumble paks come FREE with Starfox 64?
didn't the Bongos come FREE with Donkey Konga or DK:JB?
Didn't the transfer pak come FREE with Pokemon Stadium?
Didn't the expansion card come FREE with Donkey Kong 64 and Majora's Mask?
Didn't GBA/GCN cables come FREE with Four Swords?
Didn't the GCN Mic come FREE with Mario Party 6?

Hell, an extra memory card was bundled with Animal crossing so you cuold bring your character to another's town.

Nintendo's got a knack for weird peripherals that are single game-specific. But if you're not paying extra, what's there to complain about?

Also, a bit before my time, but were the Light Gun, Super Scope and NES trackmaster track bundled with games?