191 replies to this topic

[Korhend]

The Constitution is dangerous how?

Pretty much yeah, but thats a different debate.

[Doopliss]

I know, it was just me being sarcastic... again.

Back to topic, arunma, doesn't Jesus say that only his father know the secret plan?

[arunma]

Back to topic, arunma, doesn't Jesus say that only his father know the secret plan?

You're probably referring to Jesus' statement that only the Father knows the time of the coming of the Son of Man. But Jesus did say that he knows there is no salvation outside of him. So no matter how you interpret the Bible (unless you think that it's false), you can't suggest that God approves of false religions.

[Showsni]

And Jesus is God anyway. Or a part of God.

2+2 only = 4 if you first accept certain axioms as true.

Truth: I'm sitting down whilst I type this.
False: I'm standing up whilst I type this.

[Emiko]

im sorry, but i do have proof in what I believe XP

and Beck doesnt Rock <.< all his music sounds the same..

Jesus is God's son, the one person can't be in two different places at the same time, plus Jesus said no one can see God and Live...yet many people seen Jesus..so I guess everyone is dead then.. <.<

[arunma]

Yes, I know...Jehovah's Witnesses don't believe in the Trinity.

[Alakhriveion]

Beck doesnt Rock <.< all his music sounds the same..

Yeah, it all sounds AWESOME.

[spunky-monkey]

Originally Posted by Kawaii Emiko
Jesus is God's son, the one person can't be in two different places at the same time

The definition of a person is a human being,
God is everything and everywhere,
God is not a person, even Jehovah's Witnesses and Atheists know that.

[Steel Samurai]

The definition of a person is a human being,
God is everything and everywhere,
God is not a person, even Jehovah's Witnesses and Atheists know that.

I wouldn't strictly say God isn't a person, but that depends on your def I suppose.

God doesn't answer our prayers directly because of our sin. If you pray directly to God you will never be answered. However because Jesus made us acceptable to God if you pray to God through Jesus, your prayers will be acknowledged.

Jesus and God are the same person, therefore praying to one equals praying to the other. Of course, it gets confusing when you put the trinity into it all, but yeah. Jesus cleansed our sin by taking it onto himself, and therefore we are without sin, enabling us to talk to God directly. If we sin again we need only confess and ask forgiveness.

[SOAP]

GAH! I'm not about to read four pages so if this has been stated before please forgive me:

Reading the first page I was suddenly struck with a quote from a movie that for the life of me I can't recall the title of. Anyways, the quote I remember clear as day: "There's no need to pray where God's hand is felt." I think that applies to us Westerners rather well as the guy who said it was an average American who had very little faith in God at all until he suddenly got thrown in prison is some distant country over a stupid misunderstanding. You can see it all around you. We live in luxury, even the poorest of of our kind living in far better conditions than most people in third world countries. So it's easy to forget that there is God when everything is going honky-dorey. The only time we seem to talk to God is when we need help with our homework, or we broke a nail, or we can't find that damn TV remote. In a way, we've become spoiled brats. But in other countries God is fully embraced and people just pray to him so they can get through another day alive.

That's why I got pissed with some of the kids I used to go to church with. I had turned athiest sometime during high school and they were apparantly try to convert me back. When I explained why I chose not to believe in Christianity anymore, this girl got offended and said I was "attacking her faith." I was like bitch please! There's girls her age getting shot in the head for even mentioning God's name in public. And here she is bringing on the waterworks because I'm not buying her preachiness. If you can't even convince yourself, why bother? She just looked at me like I was meanest person on the planet. Man if she thought *I* was attacking her beliefs I don't think her so-called faith would have lasted very long in those countries as I doubt most westerners these days.

[spunky-monkey]

When I explained why I chose not to believe in Christianity anymore, this girl got offended and said I was "attacking her faith."

Trust me I've had that problem too. I sometimes question people on why God allows evil to exist and why do we exist even, suddenly, they go berserk as if I just challenged their beliefs, or offended them in someway. If they truly believed then they would not feel at all threatened by anyone with different thoughts on the subject.

[SOAP]

Yeah I don't get that. They're are people who get guns pulled to their heads for believing in God but don't so much as flinch and some christians over here get hot under their collar just because of one little question.

But I do have somewhat of answer to that particular question of yours. It's kinda silly though: God allows evil to exist in order to make good out of evil.

[spunky-monkey]

I found out that evil actually glorifies God, and the choice between God and evil could not be clearer...of course since no one back then would, or could, answer it I had to do some research.

[Showsni]

Or else there's free will. God gives humans free will, and if they choose to do evil that's thier choice...

[Steel Samurai]

Or else there's free will. God gives humans free will, and if they choose to do evil that's thier choice...

kind of ties in with the earlier ones. We have the free will to either choose evil or God.

[arunma]

GAH! I'm not about to read four pages so if this has been stated before please forgive me:

Reading the first page I was suddenly struck with a quote from a movie that for the life of me I can't recall the title of. Anyways, the quote I remember clear as day: "There's no need to pray where God's hand is felt." I think that applies to us Westerners rather well as the guy who said it was an average American who had very little faith in God at all until he suddenly got thrown in prison is some distant country over a stupid misunderstanding. You can see it all around you. We live in luxury, even the poorest of of our kind living in far better conditions than most people in third world countries. So it's easy to forget that there is God when everything is going honky-dorey. The only time we seem to talk to God is when we need help with our homework, or we broke a nail, or we can't find that damn TV remote. In a way, we've become spoiled brats. But in other countries God is fully embraced and people just pray to him so they can get through another day alive.

That's why I got pissed with some of the kids I used to go to church with. I had turned athiest sometime during high school and they were apparantly try to convert me back. When I explained why I chose not to believe in Christianity anymore, this girl got offended and said I was "attacking her faith." I was like bitch please! There's girls her age getting shot in the head for even mentioning God's name in public. And here she is bringing on the waterworks because I'm not buying her preachiness. If you can't even convince yourself, why bother? She just looked at me like I was meanest person on the planet. Man if she thought *I* was attacking her beliefs I don't think her so-called faith would have lasted very long in those countries as I doubt most westerners these days.

You know, you sound like a devout but atheist Jew (which certainly isn't a bad thing... unless you happen to be named Alakhriveion )

[Bond Extreme]

I just want to say this.

I have faith that I am going to get the Dell XPS 600 computer. That is their most powerful computer. Every night I pray to God. I say, "God please give me a miracle to own this computer." Every single night I do this. I have so much faith that I will get this one day and soon.

I know someday I will be posting on here that I got the XPS 600.

[Steel Samurai]

I believe you will bond. But jsut remember God answers prayer in his own time and own way. It may be many years before you get that computer, or it may not work the way you think it should.

[Selena]

Don't you find it to be a little selfish to ask for material things, just for yourself, from him, when he has to... control the universe and save some lives from horrible death? It'd be your parents getting you the computer. Not the most almighty of all divine beings. I wouldn't be bothering a deity for a computer, or to find the remote, or to complete homework assignments. Those are problems you can solve on your own if you try. He's got enough to do. What with world hunger and disease and all.


I'm pretty much with SOAP on this one. His whole quoted post up there.

[Bond Extreme]

Yes that's right, Steel. God works in mysterious ways. And well the thing is I'm faithful that I'll get that computer soon. So maybe it will not take a few years. And yes I might get a different computer that is less powerful, or even more powerful.

And now for Selena.

Ok now. No it is not selfish to ask God for your needs. It says when you give to God he gives back. Doesn't that make sense? But anyway God does not mind having other people ask for things. Now with me God knows the reasons I need that computer. Haven't you ever heard of churches and families pray for the money to pay off this, and money to get that? They pray because they give. You give and you shall receive.

[Paladin Anthony]

Agreed, I'm very conscious of what I pray for... and the one thing I pray for everynight is that God will show me the way to do what he wants me to do with my life.

As for Atheist, or ANY other religion. I agree, some Christians are too sensative about the wrong things. Other religions have very good points in their beliefs. I choose to believe in God and Jesus Christ as his son. But I always take the chance to listen to anyone else if they want to discuss it. When they aren't asinine, it's quite interesting.

As for loss of faith... the only thing I've lost faith in with Christianity, is the church. Maybe it's because I'm in the environment of college where drinking, smoking, and sex are praised, but everytime I go to a church anymore... I feel like people are putting on an act. Most aren't there for the reason they should be...

[Bond Extreme]

What do you mean, Paladin? Why shouldn't those churches be there? I know you already said an answer but could you describe it in another way?

[Selena]

Ok now. No it is not selfish to ask God for your needs. It says when you give to God he gives back. Doesn't that make sense? But anyway God does not mind having other people ask for things. Now with me God knows the reasons I need that computer. Haven't you ever heard of churches and families pray for the money to pay off this, and money to get that? They pray because they give. You give and you shall receive.

Paying off your debts is one thing. Asking for a very expensive computer is another. You can bother god for it, but I think asking a Best Buy employee might be faster. Not as spiritual, I know, but shipping charges won't be nearly as Biblical.


Har har. XP


But nah. I still think bothering a divine entity for a few material posessions isn't the wisest idea. Giving's great. But you shouldn't give just to receive. Pray if you're going down a bad path and need help. Pray if you're gonna be facing some dangerous circumstances. Pray if you're lost and confused and need guidance! But pray to a Best Buy employee for your electronic needs. Or to other store clerks, depending on your material want of choice.

[Nevermind]

1. A Dell whatcha 600 isn't a "need".

2. You getting that computer doesn't depend on God. It depends on either you getting the money for it, or your parents or someone else getting it for you. That is not divine intervention.

3. It IS selfish, cos, referring to number 1, it is not a need. It is a want. Giving to God will not result in you getting a new computer.

4. Theoretically, churches pray for money for noble, selfless and charitable reasons. Again, theoretically, families pray for money so they can provide for the family itself. That works like that because it seems the only way to survive in this world is through money. So, in essence, they are asking for Him to help them survive, or in the case of the church, asking for Him to help them help OTHERS survive. They are not asking for money for a NEW COMPUTER.

5. Selena has good points too. Heed them.

[Bond Extreme]

And you betcha that computer is from God. Anything you get is from God. And yes giving to God does have an affect on recieving things. You wouldn't belive how much money my family has gotten from the Lord. Sometimes we would be in some bad money situation and then two days later we would get that money. You know why we got that extra money? We prayed!

I'm not asking for money for this computer. I'm asking for a miracle which means in any way.
Like if I somehow was a selected winner. Or even if I somehow did get the money that would be nice. Just anyway would be nice.

[SOAP]

Praying for material things is wrong because God wants Christians to focus AWAY from material things. Churches pray for money because it's a neccesity in the modern-day world to pay for food, housing, taxes and such. But go ahead wish for that computer and God just might give it to you. But it will not make you happy. Computers get infected viruses and break down over time. Also, you might just that computer but by that time what if Dell comes out with something newer and faster than that one. And where do you get off saying God doesn't mind being asked of things that you KNOW aren't real needs. God isn't a genie in a bottle you can conjure up whenever you want want some new computer out of thin air. Instead, why not pray for a JOB and the wisdom to manage your money wisely so you can save enough money to buy the damn computer yourself.

[Paladin Anthony]

I didn't say they shouldn't be there and by no means do I believe that. I don't know if maybe the feeling of Christ is different for each person, or what. But I don't feel the urge to raise my hands in the air. Never felt the urge to cry out "AMEN!" or various other cliche' things that people do all the time.

I feel God's presence in my life through my will, my inspiration, etc. But I go to churches here and everyone does "praise bands." Instead of a choir. And everone raises their hands, closes their eyes, and tries to sing along. And everytime I go, I look at these people. Some are there for social reasons, some are even there so they can justify the things they do every day. Me, I'm there to praise God simply by learning.

Seems to me like people are going through the motions. And I don't see a point... that's not true worship.

I don't think these churches should be closed or whatever, I just don't feel the urge to go... because I don't feel that what they do (and chastize me for NOT doing) is an honest worship to God for me.

[Nevermind]

I'm praying right now, Bond.


I'm praying to Dear Lord Jesus that you aren't serious...

[Bond Extreme]

WELL DUH. OF course I'm praying for a job. I'm trying to get a job at publix. If I raise the money in a matter of months I consider that a miracle. A miracle for that job.

Edit. And Jesus is saying back to you. (You) can't be serious......

[Nevermind]

Yeah that's true.

I mean, why would I bring such a trivial matter to His attention when He has more important things to do, like provide new computers to people.