214 replies to this topic

[Average Gamer]

What? You sure you're even playing the same game? Fighting Igos du Ikana and Wart were no laughing matter first time round.

While Wart actually was a rather difficult mini-boss, King Igos du Ikana was just a Stalfos with two extra moves. He honestly wasn't hard at all.

[Masamune]

Why on Earth do we have to have a Zelda game set in a huge sprawling country? Why can't we have one set in just one city? Do we have to have elemental dungeons? Oh... Oh... I've got it! Inspiration has hit me.

A huge city with parallel worlds. Six of 'em, one for each dungeon. There'd be a frozen over Hyrule City. A Hyrule City destroyed by a volcano with lava running through certain sections. An undead Hyrule City. A flooded Hyrule City. An abandoned Hyrule City overgrown with plants. And so forth. There'd be plenty to do because each world is the city.

What would be more fascinating is if the player had a hand in causing these various Hyrules. Take what OoT and OoA did to its logical extreme. By actively changing the past/present, the present/future changes. Beating each dungeon boss in the past, would cause a different tragedy to befall Hyrule in the future. Your job in the future is to go out and find out WHY Hyrule has been wiped out this time. The future Hyrules could serve as dungeons, hopefully altered in such a way to keep it from becoming monotonous. There'd also be an option to access these alternate futures anytime you like, even after averting them.

Overlap that with the past Hyrule having a deep enough cast of villagers to make Majora's Mask look bad, you could make these futures more compelling by only having certain survivors from that pool of characters appear in different futures.

[Ransom]

Yeah that kinda stuff would be awesome.
Sounds like just the gimmick Zelda is looking for. Combine this with the feel of a Zelda game and it would be spot on. (No talking Link or any such nonsense required.)


I'd be interested to know your main qualm with these ideas JM64?
Game franchises have to move in new and exciting directions to continue to be successful and retain their fanbase, and as long as you still have the same basic feel and gameplay/genre of the series, then anything else goes. This idea is what made Mario Galaxy such a brilliant game.
Classic Mario but with a whole new dimension.

[Wolf O'Donnell]

Please tell me none of you are serious.

I was, but now that I've thought about it a bit more it's actually kind of unworkable.

[joeymartin64]

A few things:

-The same place with differences makes it seem like it would feel redundant. This could be avoided, but it still raises an eyebrow.

-I've made my feelings on alternate realities pretty clear, so I won't go into that again.

-It seems like a needlessly complicated way of injecting innovation into the series. Seriously, if we need a new place, let's just see a non-Hyrule land, but not in an alternate world. Hell, let's see northern Hyrule, Labrynna and/or Holodrum in 3D.

[GuardianNinja]

I would like to see the very first, LA, or MM remade and in 3D (of course for MM, but I mean the other ones) maybe even pack them into the same game like having OoA and OoS combined into a 18 dungeon containing 3D wii game. What do you think?

[Nameless_Joe]

Seriously, if we need a new place, let's just see a non-Hyrule land, but not in an alternate world. Hell, let's see northern Hyrule, Labrynna and/or Holodrum in 3D.

After playing OoX, I was hoping Nintendo would continue the trend of visiting other lands around the Hyrulean Realm, with the occasional romp through Hyrule itself. Of course, this has not come to be. Instead, we get increasingly shallower (in my opinion) games centered on the same region, and following the same old formula.

Imagine what diverse cultural themes Nintendo could develop if Link had to venture to the countries bordering/near Hyrule. I'm not saying the other lands would have to be high tech, just different in terms of geography, architecture, language, customs, NEW FINAL BOSS, etc. Players could see plenty of new things without Nintendo having to drastically change Hyrule's technology to be 'innovative.'

[Ransom]

But where is the marketability in that?

We the Zelda fans may enjoy that, but remember that Nintendo is still essentially trying to sell as many games as possible; and as in the past time and time again, they do this through new innovations and gimmicks in the game. You can't just introduce a new land so that players can see "new things". There has to be something different and intriguing about it thats brings something to the game. A whole new element. Otherwise, they are safer continually setting the game in Hyrule because of their previous successes.
I'm not saying i like it, but its definitely the pattern of their game development.

[GuardianNinja]

I think he means by setting it in a new region then giving it a backstory involving hyrule or some of its characters it makes it exciting, Ransom

[Nameless_Joe]

^ Precisely. And that new element you mention could be a foreign relic which allows you to do/see things in a new way. Yeah, I'd imagine the prologue/backstory to the game would center upon Hyrule --hell, the game might even begin in Hyrule (like MM, OoX)-- but Link's Awakening demonstrated that the story mustn't neccesarily involve Hyrule, Zelda, Ganon, or the Triforce to be a good game (Admittedly, to go this extreme a direction with a development-intense home console game would be risky).

I think Nintendo may have been attempting something along these lines by starting Link at Ordona Province (more of an annex) in TP. Unfortunately, the linear nature of progression and the lack of difference from Hyrule proper just meant it kind of, well, sucked.

[GuardianNinja]

I would enjoy waking the windfish in 3D, or even revisiting Termina, I just dont wanna see another hyrule based adventure ha. I mean seriously the past 5-6 games involved hyrule directly, I guess I just miss the N64 days... Who else would pay for a revisit to termina?

[joeymartin64]

Marketability? This is Zelda. Why should there be any worries about it not selling well?

And I'm only sticking on the setting because that's how the conversation seemed to get focused on. There's plenty else I'd like to see tweaked. I want to emphasize "tweaked," because "change" is too strong a word. It's like Steve said; the formula is solid. They just need to stop treating it like a recipe.

I think setting a game partially in another land could open the door to some interesting character interaction, which is something I feel the recent Zeldas have sorely lacked. Not that the early ones were any better, but NO games really had it nailed back in the day. Now that Zelda's going up against all kinds of epic storytelling from whatever you'd want to name, "UR TEH LEGENDRY HEROE" just isn't cutting it anymore. It can and SHOULD still be there, but that alone can't carry the entire load anymore. Props for the attempts in TWW (playing with the fate of Hyrule) and TP (characterizing Midna), but at the end of the day, it just doesn't feel like enough.

Edited by joeymartin64, 21 July 2009 - 02:16 AM.

[Sir Turtlelot]

I would like to see the very first, LA, or MM remade and in 3D (of course for MM, but I mean the other ones) maybe even pack them into the same game like having OoA and OoS combined into a 18 dungeon containing 3D wii game. What do you think?

That's a really good idea, but I think they should make the older games & their sequels into a one Wii disc.

LoZ & AoL, ALttP & LA, OoT & MM, and OoS & OoA. Probably between games they should have a big cutscene.

And with the Wii's graphic capabilities, they could make the game look like how it was supposed to. Base the game's graphic art style on the game's official art.

[D~N]

Since everyone seems keen on bringing Zekda to other territories, what about this idea: Hyrule is at War with an adjacent country. Typical Zelda game ensues, but with the tension of a war and bitter hatred between the two countries. Get the King involved, Zelda could play an enlarged role. Link could fight alongside Hylian soldiers, even don their armor at points. Dungeons could still play an important role, and many could even be in enemy territory, so there could be a great deal of stealth involved as you infiltrate the enemy land and try to solve this war from the inside-out.

In the middle of all this war and chaos, Ganon could even step in, and try to do his thing. Maybe...

This would work well because it does have somewhat of an "alternate world" element; it's a rival territory where you are considered an enemy, so you will of course need a different play style, one requiring stealth and whatnot. Of course you could always blend in and resume play as normal, even gathering information from their townspeople. It could work...

[GuardianNinja]

D~N:

Take out the alternate world, put in some zelda lore, and im sold.

Sir Turtlelot:

Yeah 1 2 and LA have to be on the same disk and have a childish wind waker art style because how the artwork was made. The model for the link would be windwaker but wearing that green brown tunic instead, it would be epic to have one game begin after the other aswell

[Ransom]

Since everyone seems keen on bringing Zekda to other territories, what about this idea: Hyrule is at War with an adjacent country. Typical Zelda game ensues, but with the tension of a war and bitter hatred between the two countries. Get the King involved, Zelda could play an enlarged role. Link could fight alongside Hylian soldiers, even don their armor at points. Dungeons could still play an important role, and many could even be in enemy territory, so there could be a great deal of stealth involved as you infiltrate the enemy land and try to solve this war from the inside-out.

In the middle of all this war and chaos, Ganon could even step in, and try to do his thing. Maybe...

This would work well because it does have somewhat of an "alternate world" element; it's a rival territory where you are considered an enemy, so you will of course need a different play style, one requiring stealth and whatnot. Of course you could always blend in and resume play as normal, even gathering information from their townspeople. It could work...

Yeah this is a rad idea... but i'm not sure if open battles or warfare has ever really been a Zelda characteristic? I mean it is always going to be half-marketed for kids, and adding that element might be a bit much.

I mean i would love it, but having actual battles where people would die (at least on hyrules side) or even the insinuation that they die seems a bit Unzelda. Not being alone in your fight against evil would feel a bit weird to.

I think it would work better if Hyrule wasn't even involved and it was two different lands (neighbouring Hyrule? or maybe on either side...) at war. In this way Link would play a kind of neutral, peacekeeper role and a lot of ethical issues would be omitted.

This could work well with some kind of sweet Disguise/shapeshifter item that allows you to appear differently (similar to the masks in mm) and interact with both sides in order to solve the crisis. (It would be cool if you could turn into other things as well. Like the bosses that you defeat or something. It would be kind like Ben10 Zelda, where you collect more kick ass forms as you go.)
And on top of that you get to explore other lands.

Marketability? This is Zelda. Why should there be any worries about it not selling well?

Just remember Nintendo's new mantra of appealing to greater and greater audiences. They are all about Marketability no matter what the game.

And besides you cant just stop making a franchise marketable because it is a popular line. Yes the first game would sell well, but it would only deteriorate from there. Doing whatever they wanted with Zelda on the basis that it would sell anyway would be very nearsighted.

I would enjoy waking the windfish in 3D, or even revisiting Termina, I just dont wanna see another hyrule based adventure ha. I mean seriously the past 5-6 games involved hyrule directly, I guess I just miss the N64 days... Who else would pay for a revisit to termina?

Yeah a sequel to MM would be awesome, but god forbid they ever remake LA.
Great works of art shouldn't be tampered with.




On a new topic: is anyone else bored of how they start every recent Zelda game in a friggin village?
Bring back the "start in a dungeon" intro! One of the greatest moments in aLttP for me was the start.

I'd like to start a Zelda game as a different Character with different abilities. You only get to play Link after a couple of dungeons when you find him or awake him from eternal sleep or something. Link would then become your prominent character, with starter character coming back now and again to help in tight spots. Like in the last part of the Kafei+Anju sidequest in MM.

[Ember]

I've got it!

Why on Earth do we have to have a Zelda game set in a huge sprawling country? Why can't we have one set in just one city? Do we have to have elemental dungeons? Oh... Oh... I've got it! Inspiration has hit me.

A huge city with parallel worlds. Six of 'em, one for each dungeon. There'd be a frozen over Hyrule City. A Hyrule City destroyed by a volcano with lava running through certain sections. An undead Hyrule City. A flooded Hyrule City. An abandoned Hyrule City overgrown with plants. And so forth. There'd be plenty to do because each world is the city.

And what if that was only part of it? and afterwards you go back to termina, and finish up by gaining power from the wind fish to remove majoras mask from ganon's face then finish him off to remove Vaati's curse on the other sages, then the sages give you the power to go back in time to get Vaati's hat and remove it, then use the hat to wish for the triforce of power, then use all the triforks together assemble the triforce and its counter realm (another dungeon in an alternate overworldish place) then use the wish to annihalate Link and Ganon from the time line, then in an alternate universe all the links from every game gather and send there power to the current link to restore link into the time line (without ganon) and allow all the links to return to there respective universes and return piece to their own universe.

wow... a game idea

O.o. . . .wow. . .I don't even know what to think of that idea.

Edited by Ember, 13 July 2009 - 01:09 PM.

[Wolf O'Donnell]

On a new topic: is anyone else bored of how they start every recent Zelda game in a friggin village?
Bring back the "start in a dungeon" intro! One of the greatest moments in aLttP for me was the start.

You mean how you start off in a hut in the middle of nowhere and then have to find your way into the dungeon? Surely, that's not too different from OoT?

Perhaps it would be a great idea to have Link live in a city. Why should he always live in a village? Or maybe start off in the actual dungeon and then fill in the backstory later.

[Ember]

that's always a good way to start. It gets you into the game faster to have all of the action first. Like the beginning of Castlevania: SOTN.

[GuardianNinja]

Ransom:

Awww why not LA, perhaps a 3D one would be fun, couldnt hurt to try?

Wolf:

Yess beginning in a city would be cool, why not begin in hyrule walls, no wait, not another hyrule Dx

Ember:

I liked my game idea xD and yes more action would be nice..

[SteveT]

Yeah 1 2 and LA have to be on the same disk and have a childish wind waker art style because how the artwork was made. The model for the link would be windwaker but wearing that green brown tunic instead, it would be epic to have one game begin after the other aswell

Don't forget the sideburns down to his waist.

[joeymartin64]

Yeah this is a rad idea... but i'm not sure if open battles or warfare has ever really been a Zelda characteristic? I mean it is always going to be half-marketed for kids, and adding that element might be a bit much.

They've been mentioned, but we've never seen any first-hand. I personally think it would be awesome. Not necessarily having Link actually in an open battle, but with tensions going on, maybe witnessing one, or trying to prevent an escalated conflict from breaking out.

I mean i would love it, but having actual battles where people would die (at least on hyrules side) or even the insinuation that they die seems a bit Unzelda. Not being alone in your fight against evil would feel a bit weird to.

Zant's invasion cutscene? Plus, are there really any kids who will see a completely bloodless casualty in something like Zelda and run away from the game screaming?

I think it would work better if Hyrule wasn't even involved and it was two different lands (neighbouring Hyrule? or maybe on either side...) at war. In this way Link would play a kind of neutral, peacekeeper role and a lot of ethical issues would be omitted.

Either would be awesome, if you ask me. The one involving two different lands (and I'm kinda making this up as I go along now) could be the sequel to another game, and it could open with Zelda sending Link to one of the two lands to basically say, "Oy, pack it in, guys." Bullshit ensues, Link has no convenient way of returning to Hyrule or contacting Zelda, and he has to clean up both lands' whoopsies. Just shooting from the hip.

[Ember]

that's a great idea. it's a great twist and still Zelda.

[GuardianNinja]

At the risk of being beaten to death, if there were a zelda taking place in a year around 2300 and the technology was great, what dungeon items would you like to see? perhaps we will see hover boots again?

[Ember]

maybe a grapple beam like the hookshot. . .

[Selena]

I posted an idea like this a long time ago. Tweaked it a bit. I liked the concepts, but Zelda as the main character has been a stigma (rather than a legitimate problem) since the CD-i games, so...




Plot
The King of Hyrule is on his deathbed. He names Zelda, his younger child, as the heir to the throne due to her natural leadership abilities. Her ambitious but more bloodthirsty sibling is infuriated by the decision. A few months later, the king passes away, and Zelda prepares for her coronation. Before the ceremony is over, Zelda's sibling seizes control of the capital with their private army. Zelda flees at the instance of Impa and the royal guard. As southern Hyrule falls, Zelda escapes to a Sheikah hideout in the mountains. She recovers from the wounds sustained during the escape.

After she is back in good health, the Sheikah inform her that Hyrule has descended into civil war. Northern Hyrule, less dense and more isolated, has refused to swear loyalty to the Usurper. Southern Hyrule, essentially conquered, is firmly in the control of Zelda's sibling. The armies of Southern Hyrule are now attempting to invade the northern lands in order to reunite the kingdom.

As it is too dangerous to reveal herself publicly, Zelda dons her 'Sheik' disguise in an attempt to safely help her people. After saving Northern Hyrule, she returns to the capital to oust her evil sibling from power.


Gameplay

- Zelda can switch between Sheikah gear (light hitting but very fast) and more typically knightly gear (harder hitting but slower) as she acquires equipment. Possibly a third set for Gerudo equipment. Twin Gerudo scimitars, woo.

- No fairy companions. Rather, Zelda is informed about enemies and various other things by The Triforce of Wisdom, which allows her to telepathically assess a situation. She can also read minds to inform her about hidden truths.

- Zelda would be able to use a telekinetic "shield" to block physical attacks and certain magical attacks. The telekinetic shield can be penetrated by especially powerful attacks.

- Sheikah gear can allow her to infiltrate buildings discreetly.

- Dungeons would include enemy strongholds and conquered temples/fortifications. Defeating the boss of each one inhibits the enemy's ability to wage war.

- Dungeons are not based around the dungeon's signature item.

- As Zelda is naturally more adept at magic than Link has demonstrated, she can also master various spells.

- The various races of Hyrule might choose to support either side of the war. Goron vs. Zora?




(Could substitute Northern Hyrule for a neighboring country)

[GuardianNinja]

Thats pretty cool Selena, theres no real innovation, its perfect

[Crimson Lego]

That's quite a good idea. I think it would be pretty cool if it was based on an OoT or TP type map (i.e. the Gerudos and the Zoras team up together to destroy the Usurper, etc.)

[joeymartin64]

Thats pretty cool Selena, theres no real innovation, its perfect

You might want to look "innovation" up in a dictionary or something.

As cool as that sounds, Lena, I don't think Nintendo has the stones for it. I've had a few game ideas myself (as I'm sure everyone has), but none of them are really feasible. I'd like to see something with some of those elements, though.

[Ikiosho]

I've always thought the less humanoid races (Goron, Zora) would keep to themselves in this kind of case. The Gerudo and Sheikah should definitely play a part. And in the story, what if after things started getting better for Hyrule, the Moblins made a massive return and ruined everything?