818 replies to this topic

[GuardianNinja]

What if the manuals... Arnt canon?

[Person]

What if the manuals... Arnt canon?

The only non-canon manual is the SNES American ALttP manual, all of the other ones are canon, and really don't differ very much from the Japanese originals, even the NES games didn't make stuff up in the manual like the ALttP manual did.

[ganonlord6000]

Well, for the longest time the SNES manual for ALttP was the only version of the Imprisoning War story available, and the idea that OoT was the Imprisoning War was pretty workable up until TP came out.

And even among people like Lex, nobody takes the SNES version manual as canon anymore. I think that Volvagia_Slayer guy mentioned a couple pages back uses it for some weird "two Master Swords" theory to explain away the Master Sword being buried at the bottom of the ocean in TWW, but he's a single-timeliner, too.

Are you refering to that Ign theory a few pages back? My friend and I were looking at that sunday(and person's comments on that) and we were wondering if these guys actually played the game or just read the back of the box and the manual. Kooky doesn't even begin to describe that theory.

[Person]

Well, for the longest time the SNES manual for ALttP was the only version of the Imprisoning War story available, and the idea that OoT was the Imprisoning War was pretty workable up until TP came out.

And even among people like Lex, nobody takes the SNES version manual as canon anymore. I think that Volvagia_Slayer guy mentioned a couple pages back uses it for some weird "two Master Swords" theory to explain away the Master Sword being buried at the bottom of the ocean in TWW, but he's a single-timeliner, too.

Are you refering to that Ign theory a few pages back? My friend and I were looking at that sunday(and person's comments on that) and we were wondering if these guys actually played the game or just read the back of the box and the manual. Kooky doesn't even begin to describe that theory.

The two Master Swords idea came about because the origin of the MS in the SNES manual was different from the one given in TP. The person apparently wasn't aware that the origins are consistent in Japanese.

[ganonlord6000]

The two Master Swords idea came about because the origin of the MS in the SNES manual was different from the one given in TP. The person apparently wasn't aware that the origins are consistent in Japanese.

I was refering to that whole ign thread. Not just the MS part. Puting that IGN topic here under "Kooky theories" is way to nice.

[Average Gamer]

This doesn't deal with any kooky theories, but since I made a link before I just thought I'd provide an update: Lex is apparently trying to downplay the entire mirror discussion on ZU and he's seemingly trying to run off.

Anyway, the IGN forums are a lost cause. They make no sense at all and disregard everything that doesn't match up with their theories. It's actually rather sickening.

Edited by Average Gamer, 19 August 2009 - 06:18 PM.

[Person]

This doesn't deal with any kooky theories, but since I made a link before I just thought I'd provide an update: Lex is apparently trying to downplay the entire mirror discussion on ZU and he's seemingly trying to run off.

Anyway, the IGN forums are a lost cause. They make no sense at all and disregard everything that doesn't match up with their theories. It's actually rather sickening.

After the Wii game was announced, they assumed it was a sequel to OoT/MM with the same Link because of his hair. Yes. They based their timeline placement of an upcoming game with a plot we know nothing about on Link's hairstyle in the concept art.

And then there are those who want to say that Termina is just a neighboring country to Hyrule and disregard the manual if it says it's a parallel universe. I see that one a lot, mostly among people who either never read the manual or bought the game used and it came with no manual. The IGN Zelda boards also gave birth to Joe_Cracker, the lunatic fan who tried to make an animated movie based on the cartoon series.

[ganonlord6000]

This doesn't deal with any kooky theories, but since I made a link before I just thought I'd provide an update: Lex is apparently trying to downplay the entire mirror discussion on ZU and he's seemingly trying to run off.

Anyway, the IGN forums are a lost cause. They make no sense at all and disregard everything that doesn't match up with their theories. It's actually rather sickening.

After the Wii game was announced, they assumed it was a sequel to OoT/MM with the same Link because of his hair. Yes. They based their timeline placement of an upcoming game with a plot we know nothing about on Link's hairstyle in the concept art.

And then there are those who want to say that Termina is just a neighboring country to Hyrule and disregard the manual if it says it's a parallel universe. I see that one a lot, mostly among people who either never read the manual or bought the game used and it came with no manual. The IGN Zelda boards also gave birth to Joe_Cracker, the lunatic fan who tried to make an animated movie based on the cartoon series.

Who would want to make a movie based on that cartoon? Honestly. That is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard of. Another lost case that I've seen is Hyrule.net. I swear something is wrong with the people there as there are a lot of splitests that still place TP between OOT and TWW even when it's confirmed to be parallel to TWW and some don't even count TWW as canon because of the graphics. Whatever any of you here do stay away from there at all costs unless you want to damage your brain.

[Person]

Here is a condensed version of the Joe_Cracker saga. It's hilarious.

[Zola Revolution]

My favourive kooky theory is that there is a split timeline. Oh, but I also like the one where The Minish Cap goes first in the timeline. But, the one about the Triforce being obtainable in Ocarina of Time and that you can enter the Temple of Light while playing is a damn good one, too. Wow, I can't decide.

[Zola Revolution]

My favourive kooky theory is that there is a split timeline. Oh, but I also like the one where The Minish Cap goes first in the timeline. But, the one about the Triforce being obtainable in Ocarina of Time and that you can enter the Temple of Light while playing is a damn good one, too. Wow, I can't decide.

To quell what I posted earlier, I read a lot of Miyamoto and Aonuma's interviews and the statements they made regarding the timeline did insist a split-timeline. I admit, this is a ghey finding, but it is very apparent. However, according to what the creators said, Minish Cap does not go anywhere near the Ocarina of Time, before or after. Ocarina of Time is still very first.

Also, I will continue my project concerning a single timeline theory. I will handle the rest once it is completed.

Edited by リンクの獰猛な神, 21 August 2009 - 11:17 AM.

[MikePetersSucks]

My favourive kooky theory is that there is a split timeline.

The Split Timeline wouldn't count as a kooky theory, as it's canonical, according to the creators.

[Person]

My favourive kooky theory is that there is a split timeline. Oh, but I also like the one where The Minish Cap goes first in the timeline. But, the one about the Triforce being obtainable in Ocarina of Time and that you can enter the Temple of Light while playing is a damn good one, too. Wow, I can't decide.

The split timeline was confirmed right after TP came out. Us fans didn't come up with the idea, Eiji Aonuma and Shigeru Miyamoto did as they were developing TWW. It's pretty much impossible to fit TP in the same timeline as TWW. At the very least, this is the canonical timeline:

......TWW-PH-ST
...... /
OoT
.......\
........MM-TP

[Zola Revolution]

I have read their comments concerning the timeline and I am well aware, now, that it is split. However, like I said, I will keep my single timeline theory and will take care of the rest at a time when it is complete. It is very long and very detailed so it is taking quite a bit of time to complete. Especially after Spirit Tracks is released, it will take that much longer.

Anyways, back to the split. Like I have said, somewhere, before; Majora's Mask and Wind Waker cannot go on the same line. Here is an alternative that I think more matches what the creators have (or maybe not, just theory here):

Ocarina of Time

*Split*

Hyrule 1: Twilight Princess : Minish Cap : Four Sword Adventure : Four Swords : Oracle of Ages

Hyrule 2: Majora's Mask : Wind Waker : Phantom Hourglass : Link's Awakening : (Back Story) : A Link to the Past :
Legend of Zelda : Adventure of Link : Oracle of Seasons

*Combine*

Oracle Ending (The ending of each oracle game is linked together as one ending)

[Person]

I have read their comments concerning the timeline and I am well aware, now, that it is split. However, like I said, I will keep my single timeline theory and will take care of the rest at a time when it is complete. It is very long and very detailed so it is taking quite a bit of time to complete. Especially after Spirit Tracks is released, it will take that much longer.

Anyways, back to the split. Like I have said, somewhere, before; Majora's Mask and Wind Waker cannot go on the same line. Here is an alternative that I think more matches what the creators have (or maybe not, just theory here):

Ocarina of Time

*Split*

Hyrule 1: Twilight Princess : Minish Cap : Four Sword Adventure : Four Swords : Oracle of Ages

Hyrule 2: Majora's Mask : Wind Waker : Phantom Hourglass : Link's Awakening : (Back Story) : A Link to the Past :
Legend of Zelda : Adventure of Link : Oracle of Seasons

*Combine*

Oracle Ending (The ending of each oracle game is linked together as one ending)

The Oracles games have to go together on one timeline. If you play one, the other one is a sequel to it. It goes OoS-OoA or OoA-OoS, but there's no evidence that they're supposed to be on separate timelines. There's no way that the two timelines would combine back into one. Link never crosses a temporal barrier and meets his alternate universe counterpart or anything that would suggest that. The Link sfrom OoS and OoA are the same guy.

[Zola Revolution]

Ah, OK. I see what you mean. I don't know then. I will revise it but it won't be my main project. My original timeline still is.

[Jarsh]

More ZU complaining. Surprised?

Anyhow, I guess some of the people there are still using the NoA version of the ALttP manual as evidence. I'm not the only one in thinking that it's inaccurate, right? Something about how the NoA manual mentions old ruins that once housed the Triforce, and suddenly it's obviously the Temple of Time. Because the translator was accurate about this (well, they say that even though the ToT housed the entrance to the Sacred Realm, not the Triforce, it's accurate enough), it was definitely intentional on NoJ's part. Never mind all of the other inconsistencies/mistranslations.

[Zola Revolution]

I don't know why, but Americans like to make something into what they want it to be. That is why the American version of Shenlong Ch'iu series is so terrible. That is why all of the characters and the storyline of Every other show is so different. It is ignorance that fuels the inconsistencies and innacuracies in the Zelda series. That is why I believe that everything is best in its original form.

[MikePetersSucks]

I don't know why, but Americans like to make something into what they want it to be. That is why the American version of Shenlong Ch'iu series is so terrible. That is why all of the characters and the storyline of Every other show is so different. It is ignorance that fuels the inconsistencies and innacuracies in the Zelda series. That is why I believe that everything is best in its original form.

To be fair, every country in the world does this to some degree. I remember watching a Japanese dub of Charlie Brown and changed the character's names, and made the adult characters understandable because of Japanese cultural values finding this offensive.

[Raien]

To be fair, every country in the world does this to some degree. I remember watching a Japanese dub of Charlie Brown and changed the character's names, and made the adult characters understandable because of Japanese cultural values finding this offensive.

I'm intrigued. Why do the Japanese find the unintelligible adult dialogue offensive?

[joeymartin64]

My guess is because of that whole "respect your elders" thing, but don't take my word for it.

I'm more curious about what they made them SAY? It's not like there was any orignal dialogue to translate. Did they just make up context-appropriate stuff or what?

[Zola Revolution]

Haha. Me too for that matter. It must have been words that were rather wise, however the children wouldn't understand it at first...? Huh.

[MikePetersSucks]

I'm intrigued. Why do the Japanese find the unintelligible adult dialogue offensive?

Mainly respecting your elders, taking their word as valuable wisdom, etcetera. It's like making a cartoon for the American viewerbase that consisted of nothing but terrorist attacks.

I'm more curious about what they made them SAY? It's not like there was any orignal dialogue to translate. Did they just make up context-appropriate stuff or what?

Yea. It's really quite a travesty though, as they still make the kids make empty comments towards it.

[Zola Revolution]

Interesting.

[ganonlord6000]

Do any of you here remember that timeline video I put here about a month ago (It's at the top of page 5 on this thread)? It turns out that that guy is even worse than I thought. Many comments on there point to pieces of interviews and a lot of other things which proves that TMC is before the FS games and yet he still places it at the end of the timeline. now that is a lost case.

[Person]

Do any of you here remember that timeline video I put here about a month ago (It's at the top of page 5 on this thread)? It turns out that that guy is even worse than I thought. Many comments on there point to pieces of interviews and a lot of other things which proves that TMC is before the FS games and yet he still places it at the end of the timeline. now that is a lost case.

What exactly is his justification for doing so, when it's obvious that it's a prequel?

[Zola Revolution]

Do any of you here remember that timeline video I put here about a month ago (It's at the top of page 5 on this thread)? It turns out that that guy is even worse than I thought. Many comments on there point to pieces of interviews and a lot of other things which proves that TMC is before the FS games and yet he still places it at the end of the timeline. now that is a lost case.

What exactly is his justification for doing so, when it's obvious that it's a prequel?

Also, Vaati was a wind mage, not a dark wizard, which is his form in Minish Cap until the very end

I think that was it...lshsic

[ganonlord6000]

You guys should check out this. There is evidence taken from ALTTP's US manual everywhere and seriously, why would people believe that the oracles take place on different timelines and that they combine the timelines? It is hard to tell if this is as kooky as that Youtube theory I showed you guys.

[ganonlord6000]

I know this probably has nothing to do with kooky theories, but I mentioned Zelda Informer earlier and got in a small argument with Ermigard there regarding if LOZ's Ganon is Trident Ganon either yesterday or Friday. I mentioned that artwork from ALTTP's players guide and he dismissed it saying that other pieces of artwork in that guide where unreliable. BS-LOZ was also mentioned and he said that it shouldn't be viewed as canon even though Nintendo helped to develop it. How can someone not see the obvious creators intent here regarding Ganon and the trident in LOZ? Some of the people on ZI are turning out to be just as bad as some of the people on ZU.

[Person]

I know this probably has nothing to do with kooky theories, but I mentioned Zelda Informer earlier and got in a small argument with Ermigard there regarding if LOZ's Ganon is Trident Ganon either yesterday or Friday. I mentioned that artwork from ALTTP's players guide and he dismissed it saying that other pieces of artwork in that guide where unreliable. BS-LOZ was also mentioned and he said that it shouldn't be viewed as canon even though Nintendo helped to develop it. How can someone not see the obvious creators intent here regarding Ganon and the trident in LOZ? Some of the people on ZI are turning out to be just as bad as some of the people on ZU.

It's because they want the Miyamoto order to work, when it simply doesn't, so they dismiss everything that contradicts it. Things like retcons don't exist in their timelines, when Zelda's actually been full of them. Remember when OoT was supposed to lead straight into ALttP?