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More clues to the new game's placement


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#31 Guest_Jabba_*

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Posted 06 May 2005 - 02:09 PM

Although i think its not OoT Link anymore, I think Aonuma might be trying to trick us by saying that there not the ones from OoT but they cant be the only Gorons in the world. Still I think we have to wait til E3. A new Link or AOL placement seems likely.

#32 Chaltab

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Posted 06 May 2005 - 09:07 PM

This has happened with both TWW (sorta) and even more so with FSA, Satan and Nintendo's lovechild. Seriously, ever since Miyamoto left, the series has been declining dramticly, timeline-wise and everything else-wise.


Despite the number FSA did on the Timeline theories, I don't think it was really a bad game at all.

The sound was annoyingly midi, but otherwise 'twas solid, as was Minish Cap.

#33 Fyxe

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Posted 07 May 2005 - 08:29 AM

I have also been playing FSA both on single player and with two players. Clearly it is designed mainly as a multiplayer game, and is a VERY fun one at that, but even as a single player game it's highly enjoyable. I especially love Link's new abilities, and some of the impressive boss fights (THEY USE THE MUSIC FROM A LINK TO THE PAST, WHOO. Ok, it's not the best rendition but it's not *that* bad. So still whoo..).

I don't think Aonouma is tricking anyone. O.o'' Just being subtle. We already know that the Gorons in OoT aren't the only Gorons.

Oh yeah, and Miyamoto never 'left'. He just took a step back. He still oversees things.

Oh, and Minish Cap is A FRICKIN' WONDERFUL GAME, and a hark back to the classics. One of the best Zelda games in the series, I'd even suggest.

#34 MikePetersSucks

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Posted 07 May 2005 - 12:18 PM

I have also been playing FSA both on single player and with two players. Clearly it is designed mainly as a multiplayer game, and is a VERY fun one at that, but even as a single player game it's highly enjoyable. I especially love Link's new abilities, and some of the impressive boss fights (THEY USE THE MUSIC FROM A LINK TO THE PAST, WHOO. Ok, it's not the best rendition but it's not *that* bad. So still whoo..).


O.O Kindred! *hug* :o

#35 Chaltab

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Posted 07 May 2005 - 02:23 PM

I am waiting till I see the opening and closing cutscenes to determine this game's placement.

#36 MikePetersSucks

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Posted 08 May 2005 - 06:45 PM

I'd be waiting till I play the GAME, but to each his own

#37 Guest_TanakaBros06_*

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Posted 08 May 2005 - 06:54 PM

I think that's what he meant.

#38 29-Year-Old-From-Georgia

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Posted 08 May 2005 - 06:55 PM

Bah, everyone misinteruting what I'm saying.

What I meant was, FSA pretty much destroyed what everyone though of the timeline. It and the FS games can pretty much be placed anywhere, and many timelines are now very different. I'm fearing that Z05 will also do that. I think FSA was one of the best GCN games, it was just very vague on where if took place in the series, or if it takes place in the series at all.

#39 Fyxe

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Posted 08 May 2005 - 07:06 PM

On the subject of the comment about the Gorons, I don't think that means anything at all. All he said is that they wouldn't be the Gorons from OoT, which was the most well-known and the first appearance of the Gorons, in which they were for the most part peaceful and friendly.

I thought all he was hinting at is that it would be a different tribe to the tribe of Gorons most people think of when they see the word 'Goron' (the Gorons from OoT), and thus they might be somewhat more aggressive.

I'm still going with 'happens sometime (and by sometime that could be centuries) after TWW' until we get real hints to it's placement. Or until we play the damn thing.

As for being the 'Fierce Wars'.. No. Zelda, Link and Ganon all doing stuff only a few years before OoT starts? About as likely as God coming down tomorrow and saying 'hello, how're things? Free cookies for all'.

#40 Neon Z

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Posted 09 May 2005 - 08:29 AM

No. I'm pretty sure they said WW was originally going to be before all other Zelda games. If I remember correctly, Miyamoto said it would be nice to have a new start or something along those lines (though I might be wrong).

I couldn't find an interview about WW's placement before WW's release, however, that one line about a new start is from Aonuma, and he was talking about how he wanted to create a new world to give more freedom to his own games(in reference to why did he destroy Hyrule at the end of Wind Waker).

Again. No. They have very recently said that they do not intend to disclose when the game is set, and then said that they haven't decided for sure. Read up on your articles. If I had more time I would provide quotes but I'm busy so do your own research.


Here's it...

EGM: Where does this Zelda fit in the overall series timeline?  

EA: I can't really go into that, partially because I want to keep it a secret, but also because we haven't decided yet. There are some kinds of...unstable, uncertain ideas we're working on. Depending on what course we choose in terms of developtment, the final ending may change.


Notice how he mentions specifically the ending changing. That's the part which hasn't been decided yet, the ending. Don't you think it's too late to go back and change the entire game's storyline?

#41 mohammedali

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Posted 09 May 2005 - 09:52 AM

I couldn't find an interview about WW's placement before WW's release, however, that one line about a new start is from Aonuma, and he was talking about how he wanted to create a new world to give more freedom to his own games(in reference to why did he destroy Hyrule at the end of Wind Waker).

It's not that quote. There was a quote way before WW was released saying it would be a prequal to all games, but as I said, I may be mistaken. I believe Miyamoto-san was the one that said it.


Notice how he mentions specifically the ending changing. That's the part which hasn't been decided yet, the ending.

Reread the same quote you provided. Here is the main part you need to read.

EGM: Where does this Zelda fit in the overall series timeline?

EA: I can't really go into that, partially because I want to keep it a secret, but also because we haven't decided yet.


Don't you think it's too late to go back and change the entire game's storyline?

Of course it is. It's Nintendos oldest trick... They give out misinformation because they keep getting asked that same question before development is properally on the way. Then, they make a final decision and don't tell anyone until a lot closer to the release. You tell me, if it is confirmed that the game is after WW, then why is Anouma-san being so hush about where this Zelda goes all of a sudden. Seems rather suspect doesn't it?

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#42 Neon Z

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Posted 09 May 2005 - 11:40 AM

...

Reread the same quote you provided. Here is the main part you need to read.

EGM: Where does this Zelda fit in the overall series timeline?

EA: I can't really go into that, partially because I want to keep it a secret, but also because we haven't decided yet.

But you can't just take that out of context. Just after he said that, he spoke a little more about the matter:

There are some kinds of...unstable, uncertain ideas we're working on.


That means that its place in the timeline hasn't been decided because of some unstable uncertain ideais, which they're still working on. But he doesn't stop, and said even more about that matter:

Depending on what course we choose in terms of developtment, the final ending may change.


Here, we see that those uncertain ideas which make this game's place in the timeline uncertain are related to the ending.

I believe that it means they just haven't decided which game should this be a prequel to, it says nothing about what happened before this game, unless the ending has some huge time-travelling element... So, at least, IMO, this interview does not contradict early statements about the placement of this game.

#43 mohammedali

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Posted 09 May 2005 - 12:01 PM

snip

The fact is that they are not telling us when this game is. They first said it was a sequal to WW, they then said it was a secret, they even go on to say they don't know themselves. All 3 of these answers are inconsistant with each other. The Explination? They don't want to tell us yet. Of course they know when it is set, and there is every chance it has nothing to do with WW. I recon that they just said it was a sequal to WW to throw people off. Infact, if you read the EGM article from just a few months ago, Anouma-san was saying they were sticking to the Celda look, but he was obviously just throwing everyone off track. Similarly, the same can be said about this being placed after WW. i.e. it's just done to throw you off. Hence, this game isn't necesseraly after WW. End of topic.

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#44 Neon Z

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Posted 09 May 2005 - 01:34 PM

The fact is that they are not telling us when this game is. They first said it was a sequal to WW, they then said it was a secret, they even go on to say they don't know themselves. All 3 of these answers are inconsistant with each other.

The fact is that there were only two answers, not three, and they do not contradict each other.

Infact, if you read the EGM article from just a few months ago, Anouma-san was saying they were sticking to the Celda look, but he was obviously just throwing everyone off track.

Proof? You keep talking about several articles and interviews which supposedly show contradictions and prove that the word of EA and SM doesn't mean much, yet, you always seem to be unable to post text from a single article/interview.

Similarly, the same can be said about this being placed after WW. i.e. it's just done to throw you off. Hence, this game isn't necesseraly after WW. End of topic.

:rolleyes:

You're paranoid...

#45 mohammedali

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Posted 09 May 2005 - 05:06 PM

The fact is that there were only two answers, not three, and they do not contradict each other.

Fine. If you discount the fact they said they haven't desided for whatever reason, then explain to me WHY they told us months ago that this game is a sequal to WW, then just weeks ago told us they can't tell us ANYTHING about the game placement?

Proof? You keep talking about several articles and interviews which supposedly show contradictions and prove that the word of EA and SM doesn't mean much, yet, you always seem to be unable to post text from a single article/interview.

If it gets you off my back, here is the first quote I was talking about. It is taken from an article writen in July 2002, only months before WW came out. The full interview can be found here.

NP: Where does the latest Zelda game fall into the series' mythology? Early in the series or after Majora's Mask?
Miyamoto: This is the very first Zelda story. If all we ever did was try to continue the story, we'd lose some of the interest. It's fun to jump back and forth.

Here we see Miyamoto saying that WW will be a prequel to all other games which we found out only 5 months afterwards to be misinformation. I wonder where I heard that before? Maybe because I posted it 4 times. Anyway, I'm not doing the EGM research for you. You're a big boy now, so you can go to the shop and just buy it yourself. Read the article on Zelda. There you will find EGM making a point of how Anouma tricked them into believing the new Zelda was going to be cel shaded. I think MK posted the entire article on the boards, so if you really don't want to buy it, then ask him for the scans. There, I've done by bit to help the n00bs for one day.

You're paranoid...

No. You're just stupid :P

Mohammed Ali

#46 Fyxe

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Posted 09 May 2005 - 06:08 PM

Just because someone's new doesn't mean they can't have a point, or just be completely right while you're completely wrong.

*Cough*

Not saying either of you is right or wrong, just sayin'.

#47 Kairu Hakubi

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Posted 10 May 2005 - 09:36 AM

Yeah they're definitely jerks and don't care about giving us info-mation. hehehe.

#48 mohammedali

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Posted 10 May 2005 - 09:44 AM

Yeah they're definitely jerks and don't care about giving us info-mation. hehehe.

I don't think they're jerks, I think they just want it to be more exciting. Like, I really sat up MUCH more when I thought this might be a direct sequel or even prequel to OoT. It just refreshed the anticipation levels. We all want more information, but at the same time, its better when we don't get it in some ways as the game remains a mistrey for longer.

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#49 martinDTanderson

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Posted 10 May 2005 - 03:43 PM

The sad truth is that there is no official overall timeline. Each game is a seperate story involving the characters of Link Zelda and Ganon. The Events and Objects in these games are designed for the game itself, so it doesnt matter what story came before or after, as long as it makes the game more interesting a sets it up.

But developing timelines should be based on the events within the game and the backstories attached to them. No Fan Fiction, no marketing or published comments. No comments which have obviously had little thought attached to them from the Developers, and especially no comics books or cartoons.

#50 29-Year-Old-From-Georgia

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Posted 10 May 2005 - 04:43 PM

Of course it is. It's Nintendos oldest trick... They give out misinformation because they keep getting asked that same question before development is properally on the way. Then, they make a final decision and don't tell anyone until a lot closer to the release. You tell me, if it is confirmed that the game is after WW, then why is Anouma-san being so hush about where this Zelda goes all of a sudden. Seems rather suspect doesn't it?

*sing-song* I've been sayyyyying that the entire tiiiiiiime....

I need to get noticed. O_o

If there was an official timeline, then where would the fun of trying to figure out the timeline be?

#51 mohammedali

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Posted 10 May 2005 - 04:47 PM

The sad truth is that there is no official overall timeline.  Each game is a seperate story involving the characters of Link Zelda and Ganon.  The Events and Objects in these games are designed for the game itself, so it doesnt matter what story came before or after, as long as it makes the game more interesting a sets it up.
 
But developing timelines should be based on the events within the game and the backstories attached to them.  No Fan Fiction, no marketing or published comments.  No comments which have obviously had little thought attached to them from the Developers, and especially no comics books or cartoons.

Actually there is an official timeline. Miyamoto-san said so himself. I can provide a quote if you really need it, but trust me on that.

Mohammed Ali

#52 Guest_Jabba_*

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Posted 10 May 2005 - 05:04 PM

QUOTE! QUOTE! QUOTE! QUOTE!

#53 mohammedali

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Posted 10 May 2005 - 05:08 PM

QUOTE! QUOTE! QUOTE! QUOTE!

Good thing I knew exactly where this one is. It would be a mission to have searched for otherwise.

Shigeru Miyamoto: "For every Zelda game we tell a new story, but we actually have an enormous document that explains how the game relates to the others, and bind them together."
- April 23rd 2003, Superplay Magazine

#54 Beno

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Posted 10 May 2005 - 08:43 PM

Placement wise I think the only thing we can really predict is that it won't be a direct sequel to any of the games, other then Wind Waker or the Four Swords series, but from the looks of the game it would be difficult for it to be a direct sequel to Wind Waker. I meant, just think about it... When have they have released a real sequel for a game much later than the game being sequeled? All the real sequels were actually released after the game they were a sequel of.

And I doubt it will be too closely linked to any of the games, because while they like to please all the "hardcore fans", they also don't want to have many strong references or for the player to have to know anything about other Zelda games so the new players won't be confused.

So... I think this will probably just be a whole new "age of Hyrule" with vague references to past games and connecting some of the dots... but, of course, vaguely.

#55 Guest_Johan_*

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Posted 11 May 2005 - 04:13 AM

I think there will be explicit "links" to at least one major Zelda game (WW, OoT, ALTTP or even LoZ(LA). If not, why would Aonuma even mention that they are actually trying to fit the game in the :tri: timeline?

I think that that WW was great due to a very clear linkage to an earlier game; OoT. Nintendo (Aonuma?) seems to be paying more attention to the story/timeline IMHO. On the other hand, WW opened up lots of new questions.

Perhaps this new game will be set some 50-100 years after TWW, where the decendent of WW Link lives as a farmer in a rebuilt Hyrule. It would be quite a nice feature if WW Link was actually present as an old man (NPC), from whom you can hear old stories of adventure.

#56 Kairu Hakubi

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Posted 11 May 2005 - 09:39 AM

keeping us excited is great and all, but changing ones story and/or misleading people isn't cool. no hard feelins though. XD

#57 Wolf O'Donnell

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Posted 11 May 2005 - 12:09 PM

It can't be after WW, because the mark of the Triforce on Link's hand is "important"

http://www.1up.com/do/feature?pager.offset...t=1&cId=3140040

#58 martinDTanderson

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Posted 11 May 2005 - 01:20 PM

This big document, I believe is just all the ideas and planning which goes into development of the games and backstories. I dont think there is a timeline planned out being told from game to game. It would be interesting to see the word for word japanese quote rather than an interpretation.

#59 Fyxe

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Posted 11 May 2005 - 01:28 PM

It can't be after WW, because the mark of the Triforce on Link's hand is "important"
 
http://www.1up.com/do/feature?pager.offset...t=1&cId=3140040


Er... Why does that mean it can't be after WW?

Most Zelda timelines have AoL after WW, and that includes an important Triforce mark on Link's hand.

#60 mohammedali

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Posted 11 May 2005 - 03:11 PM

This big document, I believe is just all the ideas and planning which goes into development of the games and backstories.  I dont think there is a timeline planned out being told from game to game.  It would be interesting to see the word for word japanese quote rather than an interpretation.

The quote is pretty straight forward, though if you really that sceptical, you may find someone willing to check the translation was acurate. Having said that, I can't think why it wouldn't be in this case. It's not so hard to believe that Nintendo want to remain consistant... then again, maybe it is :P

Mohammed Ali




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