EDIT: Just realised people have been posting spoilers in the other HBP thread, in my excitement I didnt check it first! You can close/delete this if you like mods! Or else leave it open for free spoiler discussion! END EDIT!
OK, have finished reading the book near 3 hours now...
If you didnt get the fact that there are MAJOR spoilers, like ruining the whole plot, then go now!
You've had your chance!
Ok, first of all, the identity of the half blood prince himself, was pretty shocked to learn it was Snape! I am still shocked that he killed Dumbledore! How could be betray his trust like that? At the end of the Book 5, I actually felt sorry for his character. Now all trace of pity has vanished. I'll never forgive the character... Still, I suppose he's not TRUELY dead, as his portrait is in the headmistrisses office...
Anybody have any theories as to who R.A.B. is? I reckon that its going to end up being Blacks younger brother, but I am probably completely wrong!
All in all, twas a great book! I really enjoyed it! Then again, I enjoyed all the Harry Potter books! What did you guys think?
Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince (SPOILERS!!!)
Started by
Tekky
, Jul 16 2005 03:23 PM
160 replies to this topic
#1
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Posted 16 July 2005 - 03:23 PM
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 07:28 AM
Poor old Aragog died...
And Amelia Bones. That was sad.
I thought RAB was probably Regulus Black too.
And Amelia Bones. That was sad.
I thought RAB was probably Regulus Black too.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 08:09 AM
Yeah, Regulous sounds like the character.
My theory is that Snape was doing as he was ordered to do, by dumbledor. Hear me out, Draco was going to kill him, but dumbledoor didn't want Draco to lose the little innocence left in his soul, so snape knew that he must step in. Snape will play a major part in the next story, but I still believe he is on the good guys side. Now Voldemort has to trust him, sorta.
Draco must help harry destroy Voldemort, I presume that much.
My theory is that Snape was doing as he was ordered to do, by dumbledor. Hear me out, Draco was going to kill him, but dumbledoor didn't want Draco to lose the little innocence left in his soul, so snape knew that he must step in. Snape will play a major part in the next story, but I still believe he is on the good guys side. Now Voldemort has to trust him, sorta.
Draco must help harry destroy Voldemort, I presume that much.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 08:46 AM
There's one little part I didn't understand, the apparent pleading.
Earlier in the book Dumbledore and Snape were arguing, insinuating that Snape had told Dumbledore about the Unbreakable Vow he made with Narcissa. Therefore Dumbledore knew he had to be killed either by Malfoy or Snape, or that Snape would sacrifice himself to save Albus. Of course, Snape presents a better chance of defeating Voldemort if he remains a double-agent on the side of good, and so Dumbledore will have accepted his own death as worthwhile.
Thus, if Dumbledore knew he had to die, why did he appear to beg? Surely he would've said something funnier, more apt, or profound in his final moments, but intead he pleaded! Why?
The only reason I can think of is that Snape really has gone back to Death Eating and the plan wasn't for him to kill Dumbledore, making my above interpretation debunked in which case the book's BLOWN MY MIND! I was so sure, and still am to a degree, that Snape is actually not evil. That the fight with Harry by the edge of the grounds was just to keep up his appearance as a Death Eater.
It would be even a bigger mind bender if it turns out in the final book that Dumbledore isn't dead after all! I'm suspicious of this green potion he drunk in the cave.
I like the Regulus theory, though I could do with going over all the parts where it mentions he's dead. After all, the only reason 12 Grimmauld Place went to Harry is because Regulus is dead.
Ohhhh, this is gonna be fun theorizing until the next book in approximately..... two years? Shit.
Earlier in the book Dumbledore and Snape were arguing, insinuating that Snape had told Dumbledore about the Unbreakable Vow he made with Narcissa. Therefore Dumbledore knew he had to be killed either by Malfoy or Snape, or that Snape would sacrifice himself to save Albus. Of course, Snape presents a better chance of defeating Voldemort if he remains a double-agent on the side of good, and so Dumbledore will have accepted his own death as worthwhile.
Thus, if Dumbledore knew he had to die, why did he appear to beg? Surely he would've said something funnier, more apt, or profound in his final moments, but intead he pleaded! Why?
The only reason I can think of is that Snape really has gone back to Death Eating and the plan wasn't for him to kill Dumbledore, making my above interpretation debunked in which case the book's BLOWN MY MIND! I was so sure, and still am to a degree, that Snape is actually not evil. That the fight with Harry by the edge of the grounds was just to keep up his appearance as a Death Eater.
It would be even a bigger mind bender if it turns out in the final book that Dumbledore isn't dead after all! I'm suspicious of this green potion he drunk in the cave.
I like the Regulus theory, though I could do with going over all the parts where it mentions he's dead. After all, the only reason 12 Grimmauld Place went to Harry is because Regulus is dead.
Ohhhh, this is gonna be fun theorizing until the next book in approximately..... two years? Shit.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 08:58 AM
You know, when reading the book, i somehow knew Dumbledore was going to die...but as Tekky said, i dont think Dumbledore could have been downed so easily...yet it all depends on the next book. (Puts a lot of pressure on J.K. Rowling)
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 09:11 AM
She wont let us down. Whatever the result, it will be spectacular.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 10:26 AM
For the Regulus theory, it says that he died just a little before Voldemort tried to kill Harry. Perhaps the reason he died was because he went to the good side and was killed for it. In the note that was in locket, it says ,"I know I will be dead long before you read this..." If he had done this, then he probably knew he was going to be killed for going to the good side.
I was surprised that Snape was the half-blood Prince. Though when you think about it now, it makes sense. He is a potions master, after all. And how about that sectumsempra spell...Snape was able to fix up Draco really quickly, but I'm sure most of the teachers could do that. But he reconized the spell.
The part where Draco is crying to Myrtle makes you pitty the character who creates most of the trouble for Harry. Even he felt pitty for Draco. But I don't blame Draco for breaking down...he's only sixteen. I thought this part and the one where is suppose to be killing Dumbledore shows that he really isn't all that evil. He's trying to live up to what his father wants him to be, but he really does have a heart.
I really liked this book. It was definately worth the sleep I missed reading it! The next one can't come soon enough.
I was surprised that Snape was the half-blood Prince. Though when you think about it now, it makes sense. He is a potions master, after all. And how about that sectumsempra spell...Snape was able to fix up Draco really quickly, but I'm sure most of the teachers could do that. But he reconized the spell.
The part where Draco is crying to Myrtle makes you pitty the character who creates most of the trouble for Harry. Even he felt pitty for Draco. But I don't blame Draco for breaking down...he's only sixteen. I thought this part and the one where is suppose to be killing Dumbledore shows that he really isn't all that evil. He's trying to live up to what his father wants him to be, but he really does have a heart.
I really liked this book. It was definately worth the sleep I missed reading it! The next one can't come soon enough.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 12:05 PM
I read this book as fast as I could, under 24 hours, that I did. This was indeed a brilliant book! So many theories!
I completely agree with you there. I believe it is Regulus is actually on the good side and he wanted to thwart Voldemort's plans somehow by taking the real Horcrux and putting it somewhere...not exactly sure yet.
I had many ideas of who the HBP would be, however, I forget if Snape was one of them or not. When reading the part where the HBP is introduced, I gained the feeling of Snape having a high possibility of being the HBP. The big piece of evidence was of course the potions book in the same room that Snape used to teach in as a potions teacher. There were more relevant clues throughout the book, mainly towards the last half that supported his role.
Yeah, I can't believe Snape simply killed Dumbledore. That was wicked and dispicable. Prior to this book I thought he was on the good side, but once the beginning of this book was read, then my thoughts became altered. Now after killing Dumbledore, I really despise the character. But perhaps it was necessary? Because if Malfoy didn't kill Dumbledore or someone, then Voldemort would kill Malfoy because he didn't follow his orders. And if Malfoy died, then Snape would die too, because the unbreakable vow would be broken when the death of Malfoy. And like Vet said earlier, if Snape died, then the chance of defeating Voldemort would be lower, because he will no longer be a double agent to both sides, to perhaps benefit the good side. Dumbledore couldn't possibly be in that position, but Snape could. I still don't understand why he was pleading. Maybe to get the deatheaters watching him to think that he really was not on Snape's side or accepting his death for Snape to move on in overcoming Voldemort. Who knows? Snape's position is definitely one of those mind pondering things.
For the Regulus theory, it says that he died just a little before Voldemort tried to kill Harry. Perhaps the reason he died was because he went to the good side and was killed for it. In the note that was in locket, it says ,"I know I will be dead long before you read this..." If he had done this, then he probably knew he was going to be killed for going to the good side.
I completely agree with you there. I believe it is Regulus is actually on the good side and he wanted to thwart Voldemort's plans somehow by taking the real Horcrux and putting it somewhere...not exactly sure yet.
I had many ideas of who the HBP would be, however, I forget if Snape was one of them or not. When reading the part where the HBP is introduced, I gained the feeling of Snape having a high possibility of being the HBP. The big piece of evidence was of course the potions book in the same room that Snape used to teach in as a potions teacher. There were more relevant clues throughout the book, mainly towards the last half that supported his role.
Yeah, I can't believe Snape simply killed Dumbledore. That was wicked and dispicable. Prior to this book I thought he was on the good side, but once the beginning of this book was read, then my thoughts became altered. Now after killing Dumbledore, I really despise the character. But perhaps it was necessary? Because if Malfoy didn't kill Dumbledore or someone, then Voldemort would kill Malfoy because he didn't follow his orders. And if Malfoy died, then Snape would die too, because the unbreakable vow would be broken when the death of Malfoy. And like Vet said earlier, if Snape died, then the chance of defeating Voldemort would be lower, because he will no longer be a double agent to both sides, to perhaps benefit the good side. Dumbledore couldn't possibly be in that position, but Snape could. I still don't understand why he was pleading. Maybe to get the deatheaters watching him to think that he really was not on Snape's side or accepting his death for Snape to move on in overcoming Voldemort. Who knows? Snape's position is definitely one of those mind pondering things.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 12:38 PM
I can't wait for the movie of this.
I haven't had the chance to get the book, but I read a detailed Chapter by Chapter summary of it. Very cool.
I haven't had the chance to get the book, but I read a detailed Chapter by Chapter summary of it. Very cool.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 12:49 PM
One thing that sucks is that the movie wont be coming for a very, very long time. >_<
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 01:13 PM
One thing that sucks is that the movie wont be coming for a very, very long time. >_<
Yeah, I read somewhere that it may be in 2010 when the final movie will be out. O__o
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 01:33 PM
Just like all of you i was very perplexed over this whole Snape thing but after reading all of your replys i think i may have figured it out...i think that Snape is really on the good side even though i hate to admit it especially now that he killed dumbledore; i think that Snape most likely did it because he was ordered to or to protect malfoy from tearing his soul or both. I think it is possible that dumbledore ordered snape to kill him so malfoy would be spared AND THAT would explain exactly why dumbledore was "begging" to spare time because he knew that malfoy was struggling with this all year and he was obviously depressed so he knew that "begging" could either save himself and malfoy by putting he and his mother in hiding or by waiting until Snape would come to spare himself and save malfoy. Also i stuggle with the thought of snape being evil because if he was then why would he protect Harry from Quirrel in the first book if he knew very well that Quirrel was possessed by voldemort? Also with the whole note from the horcrux i think that if i was regulus that could explain some things so im thinking it is him. but then again who knows with j.k. shes a tricky one
i also have one other theory.... i am wondering if maybe one of the horcruxes lies within the silver hand Voldemort gave to Wormtail? because as we learned Voldemort does like trophys or things that are of great value to someone and i donno about you but i value having hands. just something to think about...
i also have one other theory.... i am wondering if maybe one of the horcruxes lies within the silver hand Voldemort gave to Wormtail? because as we learned Voldemort does like trophys or things that are of great value to someone and i donno about you but i value having hands. just something to think about...
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 01:40 PM
The seventh movie? Thats too long to wait. (of course...who knows when the seventh book will come out)
Maybe Dumbledore was pleading in hopes of touching some of the Death Eaters. He told Draco that they could protect him and his family so Voldemort couldn't get to him. I'm sure a few more people wouldn't be much harder. I do doubt my own theory though...just more of a random thought that came out. I do find it a little odd the Dumbledore pleaded...he always came off as the type who would except death (well, he kind of did, but not quite as much as I thought he would.)
Maybe Dumbledore was pleading in hopes of touching some of the Death Eaters. He told Draco that they could protect him and his family so Voldemort couldn't get to him. I'm sure a few more people wouldn't be much harder. I do doubt my own theory though...just more of a random thought that came out. I do find it a little odd the Dumbledore pleaded...he always came off as the type who would except death (well, he kind of did, but not quite as much as I thought he would.)
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 02:08 PM
Well, one things for sure. For everything that happened to Harry, he BETTER not wake up in the ending of the 7th book to find out it was just a dream. It is at that point where you would hate the book.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 02:10 PM
Perhaps, at the end, despite everything he said, he was just scared to die...
He was very old, though - about 150 or something? I'm not sure where I got that number from...
Of course, for Snape it was a choice between killing Dumbledore or dying himself, thanks to the Unbreakable Vow. How many people would die to save someoen else? If Dumbledore knew about the Vow, he might have ordered Snape to save himself by killing him if it came down to it.
He was very old, though - about 150 or something? I'm not sure where I got that number from...
Of course, for Snape it was a choice between killing Dumbledore or dying himself, thanks to the Unbreakable Vow. How many people would die to save someoen else? If Dumbledore knew about the Vow, he might have ordered Snape to save himself by killing him if it came down to it.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 02:14 PM
He was very old, though - about 150 or something? I'm not sure where I got that number from...
Yeah, you know that Dumbledore would have to go sometime, right?
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 04:39 PM
all i know is the 7th book is probably gonna be HUGE both in size and the amount of info it WILL HAVE TO CONTAIN!!
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 04:44 PM
Snape does seem to be on the good side, but I'm really hoping Rowling makes him being with Voldermort to the end. Although that's not very likely.
I thought Draco was going to die when Harry used that curse on him. That would be better, Harry would be a murderer and probably blamed "OMG! 3viL!" again by the Ministry, making the seventh book even more intresting. But I guess what happens happens.
This was definetly way better than the let-down that was Order of the Phoenix.
I can't wait for book seven now. It'll be intresting without Hogwarts. Who wants to guess on the title? Maybe "Harry Potter and the [Adjective] Horcrux"?
I thought Draco was going to die when Harry used that curse on him. That would be better, Harry would be a murderer and probably blamed "OMG! 3viL!" again by the Ministry, making the seventh book even more intresting. But I guess what happens happens.
This was definetly way better than the let-down that was Order of the Phoenix.
I can't wait for book seven now. It'll be intresting without Hogwarts. Who wants to guess on the title? Maybe "Harry Potter and the [Adjective] Horcrux"?
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 04:57 PM
or Harry Potter, The TRUE Voldemort 
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 07:35 PM
katie Curic is interviewing jk on the today show tomorrow
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 08:35 PM
inisheJuly 16th 9:30 AM - Got book
July 16th 10:00 AM - Read book until 3:30 and went to work (went through 250 pages easy)
July 16th 10:30 PM - Got home and began reading again until 4:00AM (went through another 200 or so pages)
July 17th 11:00AM - woke up and began reading again until 1:00 until I got ready for work (had 10 pages left)
July 17th 1:15PM - Was brushing my teeth when I realized that RAB must be Regulus Black (I guess it's jsut common knowlege now. lol )
July 17th 7:45PM - got home and finished book
What I think is gonna happen in the final book, is that Harry's gonan figure out who RAB is and is gonna use #12 Grimmauld Place as his main center of operation with Hermoine and Ron. Also, I think Malfoy's still got some good in him. In addition, didn't Dumbledore say in the first book that Death would be a great adventure? I believe he was prepared ages ago and knew what Serverus had to do, even if he did seem distraught at teh moment in question. (I mean who wouldn't be, knowing that you're gonna die?) Something about Snape in general jsut stood out. Why introduce Snape to being evil in the BEGINNING of the book rather than save it for dramatic effect for the end? I think he's still on the right side, even if he is being a twat XD
Also, I can see I was wrong about Harry showing interest in Luna romantically, but at least rumors of such played a part in this book. Ginny's part isn't done yet. They will most likely hook up again at the end of it all. Of course, something's GOTTA happen with Hemoine and Ron in the final book.
July 16th 10:00 AM - Read book until 3:30 and went to work (went through 250 pages easy)
July 16th 10:30 PM - Got home and began reading again until 4:00AM (went through another 200 or so pages)
July 17th 11:00AM - woke up and began reading again until 1:00 until I got ready for work (had 10 pages left)
July 17th 1:15PM - Was brushing my teeth when I realized that RAB must be Regulus Black (I guess it's jsut common knowlege now. lol )
July 17th 7:45PM - got home and finished book
What I think is gonna happen in the final book, is that Harry's gonan figure out who RAB is and is gonna use #12 Grimmauld Place as his main center of operation with Hermoine and Ron. Also, I think Malfoy's still got some good in him. In addition, didn't Dumbledore say in the first book that Death would be a great adventure? I believe he was prepared ages ago and knew what Serverus had to do, even if he did seem distraught at teh moment in question. (I mean who wouldn't be, knowing that you're gonna die?) Something about Snape in general jsut stood out. Why introduce Snape to being evil in the BEGINNING of the book rather than save it for dramatic effect for the end? I think he's still on the right side, even if he is being a twat XD
Also, I can see I was wrong about Harry showing interest in Luna romantically, but at least rumors of such played a part in this book. Ginny's part isn't done yet. They will most likely hook up again at the end of it all. Of course, something's GOTTA happen with Hemoine and Ron in the final book.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 10:00 PM
I was personally disappointed and offended by the fact that Harry and Ginny got together (I'm a Harry x Hermione fan). After Harry mentioned his jealousy of Dean, I just thought it was a fluke and he just needed a girlfriend. After the whole, Ron is Jealouse of the Krom and Herm. incident, I found myself repeating "No" over and over again, closed the book, mowed the lawn, and came back hoping that I was halucinating before from lack of sleep.
About the whole Snape disscussion. I do believe that Dumbledore's arguement will play an important role in redeeming Snape in the next book if J.K. decides to go down that murkey road. I personally believe that he did not actually become a death eater, but is in fact mildly retarded (my apologies to euphamism fans). During the whole scene with the unbreakable oath forging, when the 3rd oath was being made (Snape will do the dirty deed if Malfoy ain't happening), it says "Snape's hand twitched within hers, but he did not draw away". This is not solid proof, concidering he could merely be surprised at having to kill one of, if not THE most powerful wizard in town. On the other hand, he may have been reluctant to have to kill Dumbledore because they were on the same side.
J.K. would not have included this scene if she did not think it were important. The scene could be used to illustrate how Snape was pretty dedicated to the Dark lord and not very to Dumbledore (my initial belief) or to put in a redeeming factor for Snape for later.
Personally, I really and truly hope that Snape is in fact a death eater, thus making his death a very satisfying one. However, there is tons of evidence to the contrary.
Malfoy is definately going to go against a certain dark lord considering almost the entire book was dedicated to giving him more redeeming factors and making his character a bit better and more pollished. I didn't really like Malfoy in any of the books, but after the train scene I gained a certain respect for him.
I am once again dissapointed Ron did not die in a book. When I bought the last book and this one, the Barnes and Noble clerks were kind enough to spoil the book for me by telling me a character dies. The reason I believe Ron should die is because of his horrible character. In the first four books, Ron is a helpful guy who sticks with Harry, through and through (although was a bit annoying in the third one). In the fifth one, we find Ron has secretly harbored a jealousy of Harry. At this point his character became rather bad concidering, he was more or less destined to be one of the most hated and bullied kids at the school had Harry not come along and he now harbored bad thoughts of Harry. At the end of the book, I was sincerely pleased when the brainish thing tried to kill him. J.k. stuck a middle finger at me when she proptly killed off one of my favorite characters soon after. Ditto for this one and the wine scene, without the promptly.
I have quite a few questions though. For starters, why are all of the current students complete morons? I mean, James and his crew, snape, and tom were already inventing their own spells when they were in the 6th year, not to say that they may not be exceptions. But still, one has to wonder when the kids will evetually get their creative juices flowing, as necissary for most carreers not involving managing a shop.
Another question thats been bugging me is, how exactly is Harry supposed to fight Vold. when he has no original spells, no ability to use killing spells, and no real talent for fighting him (he kills him by luck in the second book, lucks out in the 4th one, and Dumbledore rescues him in the fifth)? All he has on his side is luck and love. The only ways that I can think of beating Vold. with love is A) blow him a kiss and confess his undying love for him causing him to die from embarressment
B) kiss Ginny causing him to realise he's been missing out on girls and will never get one looking the way he is causing him to die of depression C) band together and try to beat the crap out of him in a students of Hogwarts vs Vold. battle.
I'd go with option A.
About the whole Snape disscussion. I do believe that Dumbledore's arguement will play an important role in redeeming Snape in the next book if J.K. decides to go down that murkey road. I personally believe that he did not actually become a death eater, but is in fact mildly retarded (my apologies to euphamism fans). During the whole scene with the unbreakable oath forging, when the 3rd oath was being made (Snape will do the dirty deed if Malfoy ain't happening), it says "Snape's hand twitched within hers, but he did not draw away". This is not solid proof, concidering he could merely be surprised at having to kill one of, if not THE most powerful wizard in town. On the other hand, he may have been reluctant to have to kill Dumbledore because they were on the same side.
J.K. would not have included this scene if she did not think it were important. The scene could be used to illustrate how Snape was pretty dedicated to the Dark lord and not very to Dumbledore (my initial belief) or to put in a redeeming factor for Snape for later.
Personally, I really and truly hope that Snape is in fact a death eater, thus making his death a very satisfying one. However, there is tons of evidence to the contrary.
Malfoy is definately going to go against a certain dark lord considering almost the entire book was dedicated to giving him more redeeming factors and making his character a bit better and more pollished. I didn't really like Malfoy in any of the books, but after the train scene I gained a certain respect for him.
I am once again dissapointed Ron did not die in a book. When I bought the last book and this one, the Barnes and Noble clerks were kind enough to spoil the book for me by telling me a character dies. The reason I believe Ron should die is because of his horrible character. In the first four books, Ron is a helpful guy who sticks with Harry, through and through (although was a bit annoying in the third one). In the fifth one, we find Ron has secretly harbored a jealousy of Harry. At this point his character became rather bad concidering, he was more or less destined to be one of the most hated and bullied kids at the school had Harry not come along and he now harbored bad thoughts of Harry. At the end of the book, I was sincerely pleased when the brainish thing tried to kill him. J.k. stuck a middle finger at me when she proptly killed off one of my favorite characters soon after. Ditto for this one and the wine scene, without the promptly.
I have quite a few questions though. For starters, why are all of the current students complete morons? I mean, James and his crew, snape, and tom were already inventing their own spells when they were in the 6th year, not to say that they may not be exceptions. But still, one has to wonder when the kids will evetually get their creative juices flowing, as necissary for most carreers not involving managing a shop.
Another question thats been bugging me is, how exactly is Harry supposed to fight Vold. when he has no original spells, no ability to use killing spells, and no real talent for fighting him (he kills him by luck in the second book, lucks out in the 4th one, and Dumbledore rescues him in the fifth)? All he has on his side is luck and love. The only ways that I can think of beating Vold. with love is A) blow him a kiss and confess his undying love for him causing him to die from embarressment
B) kiss Ginny causing him to realise he's been missing out on girls and will never get one looking the way he is causing him to die of depression C) band together and try to beat the crap out of him in a students of Hogwarts vs Vold. battle.I'd go with option A.
#23
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 10:01 PM
It will be interesting with Harry not going to Hogwarts. Its obviously still going to play a part...even though Hermione said she (and Ron) would be right with Harry through everything, can you see her staying away from Hogwarts? What would she do without the library? And of course, there is Dumbledore's painting in the Headmaster's office. That might prove to be helpful.
As much as I hate to admit it, Snape is still probably on the good side...though he's such a hard character to read! (Who knew Occlumens could work on readers too! ) As everyone else has said, Dumbledore probably rather Snape kill him than Draco. Perhaps the pleading was just a final offer to Snape to tell him that he and Draco could go into hiding. Or (I really doubt this, but my thoughts won't stop) maybe Dumbledore was pleading for him to hurry up and kill him. He never says anything like "no, don't do it." All he says is "Serverus" and "please". The only hint towords it meaning no was that it was said in a frightened tone.
I really hope Harry and Ginny get back together. They made such a great couple! And Harry deserves to have a comfort in his life. Something better happen with Ron and Hermione...I think I'll cry if nothing happens between them. ...and I think Luna and Neville will get together.
And of course, there is Dumbledore's painting in the Headmaster's office. That might prove to be helpful.As much as I hate to admit it, Snape is still probably on the good side...though he's such a hard character to read! (Who knew Occlumens could work on readers too!
) As everyone else has said, Dumbledore probably rather Snape kill him than Draco. Perhaps the pleading was just a final offer to Snape to tell him that he and Draco could go into hiding. Or (I really doubt this, but my thoughts won't stop) maybe Dumbledore was pleading for him to hurry up and kill him. He never says anything like "no, don't do it." All he says is "Serverus" and "please". The only hint towords it meaning no was that it was said in a frightened tone.I really hope Harry and Ginny get back together. They made such a great couple! And Harry deserves to have a comfort in his life. Something better happen with Ron and Hermione...I think I'll cry if nothing happens between them. ...and I think Luna and Neville will get together.
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 10:11 PM
As much as I'd hate to admit it, yes Ron and Hermione will get together concidering a large bit of the book was dedicated to their pairing and the fact that Ron comforted Hermione at the funeral :wall:.
Greenstar, im sure that Hermione will manage, but Harry won't have much money left after her reading habits take their tole. I support the Nevile and Luna theory 100%. Personally, I Think Nevil will play a big role in the ending and do his Granma proud
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Greenstar, im sure that Hermione will manage, but Harry won't have much money left after her reading habits take their tole. I support the Nevile and Luna theory 100%. Personally, I Think Nevil will play a big role in the ending and do his Granma proud
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#25
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 10:50 PM
I think Harry could probably buy Florish and Blotts with his small fortune. I don't think he'll need to worry about money for a while. I really hope the Neville plays a role in the next book. I've really grown to like him in last two books. And he's grown so strong as well. From a blundering fool in the first few books to being able to take on Death Eaters and survive, he's come a long way.
#26
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 10:51 PM
I just finished the book a little bit ago.
So, apparently, the seventh book is going to smash the formula, then jump up and down on it for good measure. It's strange, all the books say 'Year # at Hogwarts,' so what's Book 7 going to say?
So, apparently, the seventh book is going to smash the formula, then jump up and down on it for good measure. It's strange, all the books say 'Year # at Hogwarts,' so what's Book 7 going to say?
#27
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Posted 17 July 2005 - 11:06 PM
I just finished the book a little bit ago.
So, apparently, the seventh book is going to smash the formula, then jump up and down on it for good measure. It's strange, all the books say 'Year # at Hogwarts,' so what's Book 7 going to say?
Ohhh, I didn't think of that yet. Maybe "Year 7 at quest?" That is going to be a tricky thing to think of.
#28
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Posted 18 July 2005 - 12:44 AM
I just wanted to say a few things. Jo said that in these next two books that Harry would gain a whole bunch of new powers. I don't know exactly how he will be able to defeat Voldemort, but he (Harry) was given a bunch of powers when old Voldy tried to kill him. Another, we learn a bunch about Voldemort in this book. Dumbledore seems to think that knowing about the past, we learn about how kill him. But, it hints throughout that because Voldemort doesn't have the full knowledge of the prophesy that he made the choice to 'mark' Harry. Then hints that he doesn't have to kill anyone, that he always has a choice, but because Voldemort doesn't realize that, he will stop at nothing to kill him.
As for RAB... I don't have a clue, but I don't think that it is Sirius' bro. I think that it will be a new character. because the way sirius talks about his brother is that he was weak. he was scared. the letter does not hint to the person being scared at all. I talks that once he got in over his head, he got scared and tried to back out. and he was killed. it doesn't sound like he would have or even could have gotten close enough to Voldemort to even know that he had horcruxes. In fact, no one knew about the horcruxes. It wasn't until the full memory was taken that they even found out he had even thought about them. Voldy had no friends... well, at least none to speak of. Dumbledore makes it very clear that most of what they were doing is guesswork. so, i don't think that it is Regulus. although, I could be wrong, but that would be the first time.
As for Ron and Hermione. It was obvious from the beginning, that they would end up together. Hello, weren't any of you ever teenagers? and as for Ginny and Harry: I am happy that they got together. In fact, I think that she will play a pivital role in the next book. also.. Neville and Luna... what a great couple. lol.
Dumbledore had fear in his voice when pleading with Snape. I scares me to think of why he had to kill him. what would have possessed him to make the vow in the first place. I'm sure we will find out. But we know this. J.k. says we will find out why Dumbledore trusts Snape so much in books 6&7. and unless a skipped a few pages, it never explains that. So, no matter how much I hate him, i have to say he must have done it for the greater good. And another thing. Snape could have hurt harry, hurt him bad when running away, but he seemed to be teaching him. Did anyone else notice that. he never really cast any spells at him. he just kept countering the spells harry tried to cast. saying that he would not be able to use a muttered spell. not until he learned to do it silently. it still seemed to me he was just trying to teach him one last lesson. that he would need to not mutter spells but to think them to overcome whatever it is he is trying to overcome. It gives one a split second advantage. when dueling harry in the forth book voldemort was uttering spells, maybe he thinks that he is such a great wizard that he doesn't need that split-second advantage. just a thought.
This book is by far my favorite. Not as fast paced as some of the others, but the last five or six chapters are a whirlwind! I was shocked. is all I can say at the way the book ensnared me, I could not put it down. I read it in about 7 hours total. It was great.
I think that that's about all I had to say. I would love to discuss this more, if anyone has anything to say let me know. I'd love to hear it.
As for RAB... I don't have a clue, but I don't think that it is Sirius' bro. I think that it will be a new character. because the way sirius talks about his brother is that he was weak. he was scared. the letter does not hint to the person being scared at all. I talks that once he got in over his head, he got scared and tried to back out. and he was killed. it doesn't sound like he would have or even could have gotten close enough to Voldemort to even know that he had horcruxes. In fact, no one knew about the horcruxes. It wasn't until the full memory was taken that they even found out he had even thought about them. Voldy had no friends... well, at least none to speak of. Dumbledore makes it very clear that most of what they were doing is guesswork. so, i don't think that it is Regulus. although, I could be wrong, but that would be the first time.
As for Ron and Hermione. It was obvious from the beginning, that they would end up together. Hello, weren't any of you ever teenagers? and as for Ginny and Harry: I am happy that they got together. In fact, I think that she will play a pivital role in the next book. also.. Neville and Luna... what a great couple. lol.
Dumbledore had fear in his voice when pleading with Snape. I scares me to think of why he had to kill him. what would have possessed him to make the vow in the first place. I'm sure we will find out. But we know this. J.k. says we will find out why Dumbledore trusts Snape so much in books 6&7. and unless a skipped a few pages, it never explains that. So, no matter how much I hate him, i have to say he must have done it for the greater good. And another thing. Snape could have hurt harry, hurt him bad when running away, but he seemed to be teaching him. Did anyone else notice that. he never really cast any spells at him. he just kept countering the spells harry tried to cast. saying that he would not be able to use a muttered spell. not until he learned to do it silently. it still seemed to me he was just trying to teach him one last lesson. that he would need to not mutter spells but to think them to overcome whatever it is he is trying to overcome. It gives one a split second advantage. when dueling harry in the forth book voldemort was uttering spells, maybe he thinks that he is such a great wizard that he doesn't need that split-second advantage. just a thought.
This book is by far my favorite. Not as fast paced as some of the others, but the last five or six chapters are a whirlwind! I was shocked. is all I can say at the way the book ensnared me, I could not put it down. I read it in about 7 hours total. It was great.
I think that that's about all I had to say. I would love to discuss this more, if anyone has anything to say let me know. I'd love to hear it.
#29
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Posted 18 July 2005 - 09:03 AM
Sorry to be the voice of opposition to Iosonouomoragno, but I'm gonna have to say that I had some opposite theories. First of all, the issue of RAB. I am a firm believer in the idea that Sirius's brother Relugus is the best fit to his identity. Last book Sirius explained that his brother was a Death Eater, however that he had gotten to close on the inside and lost his nerve. This most likely came from realizing that theory of the Horcruxes. However, unlike Dumbledore and Harry, he hadn't seen the memory that there were more than one of them. Thus in his note he mentioned that he he knew about this one and made no other mention of others. The note said that he knew that he would not live long, and Regulus died 15 years prior to the last book. To find out about the Horcruxes, Regulus did not need to become good friends with Voldermort, but only needed to be a shrewd detective. Everything points to him, This late in the story I would not think they would throw in a new character into the mix with such a pivitol role. He's the obvious and right answer.
As Snape, I tried giving him the benefit of the doubt up until the last moment, but for the most part I tend to think of his words to Harry saying that his mistakes are bigger. There is one theory that is in the back of my head as to a secret behind this betrayal and I think that it could be the final plan of Dumbledore. Knowing that Snape had made the vow for Malfoy, and Knowing the position that he was in with the vow itself and it's power to kill and his close proximity to Voldermort, This was the perfect plan to put someone with a perfect story closest to Voldermort. Think about it. Snape and Dumbledore were fighting about a job that was Snape's to do, This was to kill him when the time came. When they arrived back to the castle, he talked Malfoy out of killing him and wanted Harry to bring Snape to him knowing that this was Malfoy's plan that was happening. Since Draco did not kill Dumbledore, that meant that it had to fall to Snape and he did it without hesitation. DUmbledore had to make it sound convincing and acted very well when he asked Snape please (but it was actually for him to please go through with his plan.) Dumbledore was never a begging man. He was very proud and one of the greatest wizards of all time. He would not beg for his life, he wasn't afraid to die. Snape is the perfect double agent. His loyalty cannot be questioned now. He is in the lion's den and he is in a perfect position to help and bring things down for the inside, or to help Harry finish the job when the time comes, However I definitly think that he will die in the next book and that's an almost certainty. Mind you this is just a theory and something that I'm keeping in the back of my head. But something that should be remembered. As for the rest of the book, I loved it and along with 4&5 is tied to be my favorite with a good lead. I was surprised that Ron and Hermione did not get together in this book, but am sure they will next time and am extremely happy that my theories from the first two books came true with Harry and Ginny (Cho was never meant to be.) I think that the book was more clear and consise since it was so much shorter, and that Rowling did an excellent job of continuing the story, even in such a sad way. I was hoping I was wrong but I've been suspecting for a few books now that Dumbledore was going to die and wasn't too surprise (though I can't say I wasn't saddened) when he died. I'm glad Fang did not die, and I'm happy that Tonks and Lupin are going for something special. As for Fleur, I don't really care, hopefully Charlie has a bigger part in the next one because he's always been a character that hardly exists, and I have a strong feeling that the wedding is going to be attacked but I'm hoping that it does not come to that. In closing I'm finding it hard to believe that the next book will take place at an open for business Hogwarts, I know Harry did his walk off into the Sunset, but if anything it will focus on him and maybe come back to follow what's happening with Ron, Hermione, and Ginny at Hogwarts if they keep going. I'm proud of Harry's choice to put things on hold with Ginny, we all know that's she's waited a long time for things to happen with Harry and never lost hope before and I doubt she will before Voldermort is dead and peace is restored. All I can say in closing is; I can't wait to see what happens next
As Snape, I tried giving him the benefit of the doubt up until the last moment, but for the most part I tend to think of his words to Harry saying that his mistakes are bigger. There is one theory that is in the back of my head as to a secret behind this betrayal and I think that it could be the final plan of Dumbledore. Knowing that Snape had made the vow for Malfoy, and Knowing the position that he was in with the vow itself and it's power to kill and his close proximity to Voldermort, This was the perfect plan to put someone with a perfect story closest to Voldermort. Think about it. Snape and Dumbledore were fighting about a job that was Snape's to do, This was to kill him when the time came. When they arrived back to the castle, he talked Malfoy out of killing him and wanted Harry to bring Snape to him knowing that this was Malfoy's plan that was happening. Since Draco did not kill Dumbledore, that meant that it had to fall to Snape and he did it without hesitation. DUmbledore had to make it sound convincing and acted very well when he asked Snape please (but it was actually for him to please go through with his plan.) Dumbledore was never a begging man. He was very proud and one of the greatest wizards of all time. He would not beg for his life, he wasn't afraid to die. Snape is the perfect double agent. His loyalty cannot be questioned now. He is in the lion's den and he is in a perfect position to help and bring things down for the inside, or to help Harry finish the job when the time comes, However I definitly think that he will die in the next book and that's an almost certainty. Mind you this is just a theory and something that I'm keeping in the back of my head. But something that should be remembered. As for the rest of the book, I loved it and along with 4&5 is tied to be my favorite with a good lead. I was surprised that Ron and Hermione did not get together in this book, but am sure they will next time and am extremely happy that my theories from the first two books came true with Harry and Ginny (Cho was never meant to be.) I think that the book was more clear and consise since it was so much shorter, and that Rowling did an excellent job of continuing the story, even in such a sad way. I was hoping I was wrong but I've been suspecting for a few books now that Dumbledore was going to die and wasn't too surprise (though I can't say I wasn't saddened) when he died. I'm glad Fang did not die, and I'm happy that Tonks and Lupin are going for something special. As for Fleur, I don't really care, hopefully Charlie has a bigger part in the next one because he's always been a character that hardly exists, and I have a strong feeling that the wedding is going to be attacked but I'm hoping that it does not come to that. In closing I'm finding it hard to believe that the next book will take place at an open for business Hogwarts, I know Harry did his walk off into the Sunset, but if anything it will focus on him and maybe come back to follow what's happening with Ron, Hermione, and Ginny at Hogwarts if they keep going. I'm proud of Harry's choice to put things on hold with Ginny, we all know that's she's waited a long time for things to happen with Harry and never lost hope before and I doubt she will before Voldermort is dead and peace is restored. All I can say in closing is; I can't wait to see what happens next
#30
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Posted 18 July 2005 - 10:34 AM
Whilst I too follow the idea of Snape still being on the side of good, it makes it a little weak for none of the other members of the Order of the Pheonix to know it also. They, like Harry, believe Snape to be nothing more than a murderer. Confusing.
Anyway, I don't believe that the next book will have Harry away from Hogwarts. All of the books follow the one rigid structure of a full year's term at school and I highly doubt Rowling will change that. Especially as this is primarily a children's book. Part of it's success is that you know the basics of the book before you read it - young readers find it easier.
Since Harry will no doubt pass his Apparition test, he'll be able to search for the Horcruxes as well as attend Hogwarts by simply going out of Hogwarts grounds and *pop*.
Anyway, I don't believe that the next book will have Harry away from Hogwarts. All of the books follow the one rigid structure of a full year's term at school and I highly doubt Rowling will change that. Especially as this is primarily a children's book. Part of it's success is that you know the basics of the book before you read it - young readers find it easier.
Since Harry will no doubt pass his Apparition test, he'll be able to search for the Horcruxes as well as attend Hogwarts by simply going out of Hogwarts grounds and *pop*.
