107 replies to this topic

[Chikara Nadir]

One of the beautiful things about a real jail is that it keeps criminals in- and keeps citizens out. The true seperation between the real and the one we had here is that regular LAers could come in at any time- and often had fun 'throwing stones' at the accused, which never helped matters.

[SteveT]

Bad analogy. People who are banned from a forum can still do their stuff at other forums and converse with people outside said forum. If the jail is there to satisfy your own curiousity and maybe even get a few jabs in at the person being jailed than it's unnecessary.

That is a significant difference, and like Chikara said, the main problem. Ideally, you'd want to keep some seration, for instance: only suspended users and admins could be allowed to post in the jail. This satisfies curiosity, demonstrates the reasoning of the admins, and protects the suspended user from extra abuse.

[Selena]

Which is why that shouldn't happen anymore? Only post in there if you've got questions, but not to flame or namecall?



And it's not THAT big of a deal, thabto. Like I said, if you don't want a part of it, then stay away from it. It's a fair call in terms of the general population for those of us who would actually like to know what's going on around here. Instead of taking it completely away, it's just there if you want to know or have questions. That's it, and fail to see why it isn't fair. Gossip will happen over bannings or other things, and if gossip is your main argument... heh, that's not exactly much to fight for.

[thabto81]

I'm sorry but it is a big deal when you have a bunch of people stoning a person's who's been jailed when they don't even have all the facts. I thought you were all about civility? How does that attitude among members maintain civility in the forum?

I understand you can't stop the gossip, but you can stop from fanning the fire into a huge blaze.

[Khuffie]

I'm sorry but it is a big deal when you have a bunch of people stoning a person's who's been jailed when they don't even have all the facts. I thought you were all about civility? How does that attitude among members maintain civility in the forum?

I understand you can't stop the gossip, but you can stop from fanning the fire into a huge blaze.

And who said we'll let that happen? Anyone who makes fun of someone suspended will himself be suspended. See? Simple. And it only takes one idiot to try that so others can see I'm serious. Others can ask questions if they're unsure what/why happened, and we may or may not answer, depending on the situation. But no namecalling/abuse/harrasment will be tolerated.

[Black Knight]

Exactly... jail is good. I'm always out of the loop on this stuff. For example, I never realized that Roy was banned until Jaina recently told me.

[Selena]

Yeah, thabto, as we already discussed earlier, the Jail had that very drawback. Flaming, teasing and spamming. That's why we already said this new forum is only going to be for listing who is banned/suspended, telling WHY they are as so, and allowing normal members (and apparently the suspended one) to ask questions as to how it happened and why they're in there. It's not like we fail to learn from history. We took something and improved it to where it should have been.


Aaaanything else?

[thabto81]

I've stated everything about the jail that bothers me and I will stand by it.

[Oberon Storm]

I agree with you to an extent, thabto. But this new jail thing look slike it might be OK. Although I couldn't help but notice the first suspension to happen was a joke. Don't get me wrong. I get the humor and had a good laugh.

I like how this thread has gone. The only reason I got into it was because it was looking like only certain members had issues. I wanted to break that misconception. I wish nne of this was puplic. And I promise not to let furture concerns fester in my head and will send a private message to an admin.

[Chikara Nadir]

About your fears, thabtoe- it's a good thing this isn't the jail, as...was already said.

It simply does NOT work the same way. Criticism in that forum will be tolerated in the same way as it would on any other part of the forum. As already said- insults that would fly in the old jail won't make it here. It's for seeing who was punished and asking why, so no one fears that the 'all powerful admins' are making decisions without telling anyone, or punishing people for reasons that may or may not be known.

It's so that everyone just...feels they're on the same page about punishments.

If it DOES get out of hand, we can worry about that in due time and deal with it when it happens- and hopefully it won't go that direction.

So..prolly better we worry about more of the immediate problems on LA. ^^

[Zythe]

While we're discussing flaws with LA's rules, can we relax the RPG rules? They're the strictest I've ever seen on the web.

[Chikara Nadir]

Hehe. That territory is DJ's and DJ's alone, so you'll have to wait until he's back from his weekend Geology trip to expect a response.

[Black Knight]

The rpg forum is dead, so I do my rping at another pretty cool site. Your characters there are approved by the person running the rpg and you have a character sheet which stays with your account for easy access.

[Zythe]

Which is probably better than LA's.

[Marty]

I've been thinking about where all the troubles began. When (to me at least) seems obvious - just after the hack. But why? Well, everything had to start from scratch. This meant that new members didn't have the same feel of the community but more importantly the old members were too eager to bring back the old LA. The old conversations were gone so new ones needed to be started, but it takes time for them to build momentum and people were impatient, so people spammed. Unfortunately the spam took control of everything and prevented real conversations from starting and this frustrated people, so the no spamming was enforced heavily.

When the spamming was stopped the whining started. There still weren't many decent conversations (like I said, it takes time) but people were having fun with the spam, now they didn't even have that. The whining was then stopped by more rules and by this point conversation had started to get better (although I still think it is a while yet till it gains real momentum) but a general bad-feeling had settled in by this point.

Throughout all this some members began to object to the behaviour of the admins, both sides sometimes purposefully, sometimes inadvertantly fanning the flames of bad-will towards eachother. I tend to stick to only a few forums so I don't see much of the admins/mods behaviour, but I do know of a few instances of serious inconsistency. Under normal circumstances this can be accepted, but LA is under pressure at the moment and needs its leaders to be on the top of their game.

I think I now understand how various parties intend to go out in a blaze of glory. It seems to me that the plan is to get banned for NOT breaking the rules. As fun a game as it may be (and I must say I liked the pamphlet), the only way to succeed in this goal is to try and find every hole in the system. This is actually the most destructive activity possible, even more destructive then just breaking the rules. It might provide the opportunity to sneer at the authority but it'll ruin the community.

Thats my take on the situation. Hopefully it'll add something to what has been a fairly constructive conversation so far. If not, I'll back out and stick to my forums.

[Zythe]

I have to say Marty, I agree with everything in your post.

[DarkJuno]

While we're discussing flaws with LA's rules, can we relax the RPG rules? They're the strictest I've ever seen on the web.

No.

[Black Knight]

Kind of blunt there DJ. Could you at least explain why not, perhaps?