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#241 Guest_TanakaBros06_*

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Posted 29 January 2005 - 10:59 PM

The oasis people whose ancestors built the pyramids in FSA.

#242 monique

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 05:51 AM

You know, I have a feeling Capcom itself doesn't know what the lightforce is. Because at that interview they stated it really.. uhm yea weird!

#243 Zythe

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 05:57 AM

The Zuna seem pretty nice, so I don't think they were the ones who made the Trident.

And as for the dark tribe sealed in the mirror, the game all but states that it's the Deku Scrubs.


Yes that would make a lot of sense, seeing as they first appeared in the forest where the mirror lies and they credited Ganon for releasing them from their slumber.

But what kind of army can a bunch of Dekus really be?

#244 Vazor

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 11:09 AM

Hey, give 'em some magic and weaponry, and they'd do just fine.

#245 MikePetersSucks

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 01:22 PM

Plant one in the ground and you got an evil Deku Tree, which leads itself to evil Kokiri, which leads itself to evil fairies *coughcough*Navi*coughcough* which inturn leads to the corruption of some innocent orphan.

Ganondorf: Ah, soon there shall be peace in hyrule. I have slain the evil Deku Tree, sealed off the evil monsters in the Goron Cavern, killed that awful Zora Princess, sealed the evil Sages, and made sure the Triforce of Power won't fall into evil's hands. *he smiles and does a fluttery dance like a schoolgirl, and he seems to be wearing pastel colors*

Link: DIE! *Headstab* I R Sav'd Highrool! ^_^

Hylians: >.>; riiiight....thanks.

Zelda: With the Ocarina, I can send you back in time! *does so*

Link: *appears in a world full of dinosaurs* cool! *see's a meteor in the sky* Oooo, what's that? *BOOOM*

#246 Zythe

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 01:30 PM

Topic, anyone?

Dekus right...

So are the Dekus to the Koroks as the Skull Kids are to the kokiri? When were they sealed away, before OoT or between different games? HA is fucking confusing.

#247 Guest_Darkseid_*

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 01:45 PM

I don't ever remember the Deku Scrubs being sealed off or anything, I just remember them worshipping Ganon. I take the Deku Scrubs as a race that just follows the person they think is most likely to have the most power. They are just cowards following an individual who seems like an ideal leader for them. That is how I see the Deku Scrubs. Only in Majora's Mask do they actually have a system ran by an actual Deku King, and even he isn't all that great of a leader. His little daughter tells him off just as bad as Malon could Talon.

#248 MK.

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 03:36 PM

Dekus just are what they are, plant like monsters for the most part...

Kokiri can change the form the assume and then look like Koroks (or Korogs if you translate it properly)

Skull Kids are NON-KOKIRI who enter Lost Woods, become lost, and turn into monsters :P

#249 Zythe

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 06:00 PM

How do you know they're non Kokiri?

#250 coinilius

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 07:21 PM

Skull Kids are children who get lost in the Lost Woods... adults become Stalfos, according to that Kokiri girl you talk to.

#251 Vazor

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 08:56 PM

So what happens to Kokiri who get stuck in the forest? Maybe they become Dekus, or worse, Moblins (suuuuure).
So stalfos aren't just dead people, they're corrupted travelers.
Wow, this thread's gotten really off-topic.

#252 Guest_Darkseid_*

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 10:01 PM

So what happens to Kokiri who get stuck in the forest?  Maybe they become Dekus, or worse, Moblins (suuuuure).
So stalfos aren't just dead people, they're corrupted travelers.
Wow, this thread's gotten really off-topic.


Well it was stated in Ocarina of Time that those who got lost would become a Stalfos, but I thought that had to due more with lost travelers like Grog than the actual Kokiri.

The only real reason I remember the Skull Kid being known as the Skull Kid was because Link sold him the Skull Mask.

I am also beginning to wonder if there is any connection to Stalfos and Stalchild. It seems like there would be a better connection between them two than Stalfos and the Skull Kid.

Still though I may have to go back and check this out. Everything just isn't clickin' right now, I'm drawing a blank.

#253 Zythe

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 12:29 PM

So, topic?

To resum my opinions, note, opinions:

The Light Force is the Triforce. The Minish Realm is the Sacred Realm. OoT Zelda's courtyard is the Elemental Sanctuary's passageway.

#254 Guest_Darkseid_*

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 01:26 PM

If Zelda's courtyard in Ocarina of Time is the same as the Elemental Sanctuary then that must mean that Zelda's courtyard is the gateway to the Minish Realm. Now if that is so then that would mean that the Sacred Realm and the Minish Realm could possibly be different in your eyes, considering that the gateway to the Sacred Realm is in the Temple of Time.

Remember the Sanctuary is a strange realm trapped between to worlds, which would be the Hyrulean world and the realm of the Minish. So if Zelda's courtyard is the Sanctuary then it looks like she would have more knowledge of where the Sacred Realm is, that is if the Minish Realm and the Sacred Realm are the same. I mean she knows so many other things so how come she wouldn't know another gateway to the Sacred/Minish Realm.

Another thing that sounds odd about this, is that Potho nor King Daltus could see the door that leads to the Elemental Sanctuary, but we know Ezlo, Zelda, Link, and Vaati could because they are either children or minish. Impa is able to see the courtyard just fine, and so is Ganondorf when he takes a good look at Link.

I may have misunderstood what you meant, but that is what I thought you meant.

Though I do get the basic concept of what your saying, and I think it goes something like this.

Before time began, before spirits and life existed...Three golden goddesses descended upon the chaos that was Hyrule...Din, the goddess of power...Nayru, the goddess of wisdom...Farore, the goddess of courage...Din...With her strong flaming arms, she cultivated the land and created the red earth. Nayru...Poured her wisdom onto the earth and gave the spirit of law to the world. Farore...With her rich soul, produced all life forms who would uphold the law. The three great goddesses, their labors completed, departed for the heavens. And golden sacred triangles remained at the point where the goddesses left the world. Since then, the sacred triangles have become the basis of our world's providence. And, the resting place of the triangles has become the Sacred Realm. Thus the three golden goddesses created a miniscule race only visible to a child's eye so that they could safeguard the light force of the mystical Triforce from greedy and ambitious lifeforms.

Is that sorta how you see things Zythe? I am not being sarcastic this time either, I am asking you a question in all seriousness.

#255 Zythe

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 03:00 PM

Yeah.

I would never have put the MR and SR as one in the same if it weren't for TMC. But with the Light Force, it supports any Light Force=ToW theories. In OoT, Zelda doesn't know the courtyard is the the same as the one that leads to the Sanctuary because it's not that time of the century.

It also explains how Ganon broke out of the Sacred realm in TWW-BS because if the centannual window opened briefly for the Minish to intervene in human affairs, then Ganon could quickly break out.

#256 Vazor

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 03:22 PM

It's pretty obvious to me that the Elelmental Sanctuary and the Four Sword Sanctuary are one in the same because of their similar attributes, and the gateway there is in the Castle Courtyard (which may lead to the frozen Hyrule forest where some claim the sanctuary to be). The reason we can't see it in OoT is because it's simply not that one-in-one-hundred years day. After all, why would the gateway even be visible if you couldn't get through it?

#257 Guest_Darkseid_*

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 03:50 PM

Okay this question once again must go to Zythe.

If the Triforce of Wisdom is in Princess Zelda, then that means that Vaati has stolen a great deal of the Triforce of Wisdom out of her. By the time the third bell had rang he would have drained all of the light force or the Triforce of Wisdom as you say out of her body. Then when you defeat Vaati the wish granting mage's hat is all to found. Where is the Triforce of Wisdom? Why didn't Link and Ezlo get it after the defeat of Vaati? And why did Zelda still just have a fraction of its power and not the full extent after his defeat? If we go by that it would make it seem like Vaati was able to absorb most of the Triforce of Wisdom's energy and it went with him after he went down in a blaze of glory.

Now as for Ganondorf these suggestions would work for your theory, but there is no evidence to suggest that Ganondorf was sent to the Sacred Realm in the Wind Waker. He is turned to stone, that is all we know.

I would like to comment that it would be nice to see a villain with a different piece of the Triforce, besides Power like Ganondorf most often is associated with, but I don't think that Vaati had a piece of the Triforce. To me he just had what he said he had, the Light Force.

Not to get too much off topic, but if you could choose two villains to have the pieces Wisdom and Courage who would they be. Also which heroic character do you think would best be suited with Power. I mean it couldn't hurt if Nintendo did a little rearranging around from time to time, but that will probably never happen.

#258 Zythe

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 04:39 PM

Now as for Ganondorf these suggestions would work for your theory, but there is no evidence to suggest that Ganondorf was sent to the Sacred Realm in the Wind Waker. He is turned to stone, that is all we know.

I said he got sealed in OoT. Freed before TWW. Then killed in TWW.

If the Triforce of Wisdom is in Princess Zelda, then that means that Vaati has stolen a great deal of the Triforce of Wisdom out of her. By the time the third bell had rang he would have drained all of the light force or the Triforce of Wisdom as you say out of her body. Then when you defeat Vaati the wish granting mage's hat is all to found. Where is the Triforce of Wisdom? Why didn't Link and Ezlo get it after the defeat of Vaati? And why did Zelda still just have a fraction of its power and not the full extent after his defeat? If we go by that it would make it seem like Vaati was able to absorb most of the Triforce of Wisdom's energy and it went with him after he went down in a blaze of glory.  


To hell with Vaati? Sucked into the portal (back home)? Maybe it went into Zelda and she didn't know? Who knows? And the Triforce doesn't neccesarily present itself when someone dies. Evidence? None. Unless you count TMC. Which I do.

#259 Guest_Darkseid_*

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 05:20 PM

I said he got sealed in OoT. Freed before TWW. Then killed in TWW.

Oh okay. The BS thing threw me off, but I know now you meant the backstory to the Wind Waker.

And the Triforce doesn't neccesarily present itself when someone dies. Evidence? None.



Yeah it does. Ganon had the Triforce of Power when Link fought him in the original Legend of Zelda. Ganon is slain by the Silver Arrow, and the Triforce of Power falls on his ashes. Evidence right there. This is the only instance in which this happens, because in the other games Ganon either doesn't have the Triforce, he is sealed, or he has it, but it is behind a door.

Case and point though is that there is NO evidence that Vaati had any Triforce piece at all. So the evidence in the situation is none.

The evidence in the Triforce presenting itself when someone dies is there in the Legend of Zelda, no more need in debating that.

#260 Zythe

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 05:42 PM

Being a Triforce piece (which behaves and looks slightly different from game to game) I don't think we can class any "normal behaviour" for it. I like how you cut the quote after "None", I believe that is called Yellow Journalism.

#261 Guest_Darkseid_*

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 06:28 PM

The Triforce never looks different. It always looks the same. They only thing that changes is its size from time to time, that's it. Care to look over the games for a bit.

The Legend of Zelda
Link comes through the chamber throne of Ganon's inside of Death Mountain and holds the Triforce of Wisdom over his head. Ganon does the same thing only he holds the Triforce of Power over his head. After the battle Link destroys Ganon with the Silver Arrow and the Triforce of Power falls in his ashes. Link and Zelda then hold the two Triforces up and say that peace has returned to Hyrule.

Zelda II: The Adventure of Link
Link defeats the Thunderbird inside the Great Palace, and meets up with some old man who has the Triforce of Courage above his head. I guess the old man challenges Link to a battle against a shadow copy of himself to see if he is worthy of getting the piece, or perhaps he is just an evil old man, we don't really know. Anyways Link defeats his Shadow and the old gets down on his kness and Link gets the Triforce of Courage. Returning back to North Castle Link uses the Triforce of Courage, with the other two pieces of Power and Wisdom and wishes her to arise from her slumber. The game ends with Link and Zelda behind the curtain.

The Legend of Zelda: A link to the Past
Link and Ganon fight in the Pyramid of Power, and after a long battle Link is victorious and meets the Triforce. The Essence of the Triforce speaks to him and asks him to make a wish from his heart. He does so and everything returns peaceful and normal.

The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time
In the Temple of Time Shiek shows us that he is Zelda and that she has the Triforce of Wisdom. Link has the Triforce of Courage as Shiek told him earlier, before he revealed himself as Zelda. Ganondorf has the Triforce of Power, and he shows his piece atop the corridors of his chamber. Link defeats Ganondorf and he and Zelda run out of the Tower. Ganondorf rises out of the rubble of the castle and uses the Triforce of Power to transform into Ganon. Link fights him but can't finish him off, so Zelda and the Six Sages imprison Ganondorf in the Sacred Realm. Ganondorf talks about how he still has the Triforce of Power in his hands. Also in the cutscenes of the Triforce it looks just like it would in any other game that has been before it, or even after for that matter.

The Legend of Zelda: Oracle of Seasons/Ages
The Triforce sends Link on his quest to the lands of Holodrum and Labrynna, and once again it looks different from no other game before it.

The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker
Ganondorf shows his Triforce of Power resonating when he sees Tetra, and this is no different from what happens in Ocarina of Time. Later Daphnes Nohansen Hyrule shows Tetra that she is Zelda by combining his piece of the Triforce of Wisdom with her piece. That is also nothing new as a single piece of the Triforce has been divided before, like in the original Legend of Zelda. The Triforce of Courage has also been divided in this game, and Link replinishes the piece. When Ganondorf gets them all together, Ganondorf knocks out Link and Zelda was already out prior to this. With both children down, Ganondorf throws out his piece and casts the other two pieces out of Link and Zelda's body. This is something we see, as we see the pieces floating overhead. The combine together and the complete Triforce is assembled. Daphnes steps in and touches the Triforce before Ganondorf does. The sacred relic goes into the sky and shoots off in different directions. It looks the same in this game, as it does in any of the other games.

Now besides size in appearance, how has the Triforce ever looked any different from one game to the other. That's right they haven't.

Now Zythe I wasn't trying to be harsh or anything, but give me one good nice solid reason as to why I, or anyone else for that matter should think that the Triforce or a piece of the Triforce is in the Minish Cap.

#262 Zythe

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 11:16 AM

Any of my valid points over the last 14 pages? And the in-game art, for one, which can't get any more definitive.

#263 Hero of Winds

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 11:21 AM

Any of my valid points over the last 14 pages? And the in-game art, for one, which can't get any more definitive.


All of your valid points have either been disproved or are simply too inconclusive. Unless you can provide one solid argument here and now...

#264 Guest_Darkseid_*

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 03:20 PM

Any of my valid points over the last 14 pages? And the in-game art, for one, which can't get any more definitive.


I haven't seen any valid points in all the posts that you made on this thread about the Light Force, just assumptions and theories. I would continue this discussion with you more, but you seem so stone cold dead set on believing that the Light Force is the Triforce that any reasonable explanation that is given, you just shrug it off with an "I'm right and your wrong" type thing. So I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.

#265 Zythe

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 03:26 PM

I guess we will unless I can find something new. But I won't stand down, because there's not enough evidence to force me to change my mind.

Now.

No one reply. Yet. Permission to let this topic die, admins?

#266 SOAP

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 03:58 PM

I know you don't want anyone to reply but if it's any consolation, I'm with you Zythe. On this one thing at least.

#267 Hero of Winds

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 04:45 PM

But I don't understand why you continue to think so. Aside from assumptions, all you're going on is that it took the form of a golden triange. So what? If the Light Force was the Triforce, there'd be a far bigger implication in TMC, not to mention Aonuma would've said something about it.

No one reply. Yet. Permission to let this topic die, admins?



Zythe, you don't decide when a topic has ended. A discussion will die when there's nothing left to discuss. As far as I see it, there is ZERO proof that the Light Force is the Triforce. The only thing you had to go by is the idea that the Minish and Sacred Realms were one in the same, which has turned out to be false.

#268 Guest_Darkseid_*

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 04:57 PM

I know you don't want anyone to reply but if it's any consolation, I'm with you Zythe. On this one thing at least.


Okay, maybe I don't know how to shut up, but what is the reason for people to believe that the light force is the Triforce. Is it because of the triangular art of the stained glass windows? Is it because it is called a limitless magic source? Is it because Princess Zelda harnesses its power? Why can't it just be a magical gift by the Minish handed down to the ladies of its Royal Family?

#269 MikePetersSucks

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 05:31 PM

Exactly, Darkseid. Plus the fact that the Triforce can't be stolen like the way Vaati did. and Vaati is probably UNWORTHY anyway. And if the Minish had access to the Triforce the whole time, and already gave it to the humans, why would they build and give them a Hat that did the EXACT SAME THING?

#270 SOAP

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 06:12 PM

Okay, maybe I don't know how to shut up, but what is the reason for people to believe that the light force is the Triforce. Is it because of the triangular art of the stained glass windows? Is it because it is called a limitless magic source? Is it because Princess Zelda harnesses its power? Why can't it just be a magical gift by the Minish handed down to the ladies of its Royal Family?


No offense but you're right. You and Hero don't know when to shut up. While I have my beliefs it's my RIGHT to believe them, no matter how wrong I may be. I'm not here to force my beliefs on any one else nor am I here to prove anything so I'd like it if you guys wouldn't start ramming your beliefs down mine and Zythe's throats. Seems like you two need to calm down and take a more objectional standpoint on this debate instead of going off arguing just for the sake of arguing. That is no way to debate.

And I was just about to re-evaluate my theories but I'm going to stick by Zythe just to spite you both.




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