Jump to content

IPBoard Styles©Fisana

The Sabbath Day! (Yet again)

Started by Guest_Windmill_* , Nov 26 2004 01:55 PM

  • Please log in to reply
135 replies to this topic

Poll: The Sabbath Day! (Yet again) (0 member(s) have cast votes)

  1. I'm a christian and I think its Sunday (5 votes [38.46%])

    Percentage of vote: 38.46%

  2. I'm a christian and I think its Saturday (3 votes [23.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 23.08%

  3. I'm not a christian but I think its Sunday (1 votes [7.69%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.69%

  4. I'm not a christian but I think its Saturday (1 votes [7.69%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.69%

  5. I have no opinion. (3 votes [23.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 23.08%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#1 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 26 November 2004 - 01:55 PM

Hey everyone :) Yes.... some of you may remember me.... it is I..... Windmill! ^_^ I found this site in my favorites and thought hey! I remember this place! So I'm back :P

Anyway, in the time that I've left, a lot has happened to me, and consequently I've also become more knowladgable. So yeah. Infact, I've come a lot more knowladgable in certain areas. One area I'm becoming far more knowladgable in (yet I still have much to learn) is, of course, the sabbath day.

For those of you that don't know what the sabbath day is, let me just give you a brief overview. Its a day that was given to us by God to be kept holy, to pray, to learn etc more about God on the sabbath day. We rest. We do not do stuff like play zelda today. (Its sabbath here. The only reason I'm on this forum, is because it helps stimulate me spiritually) We spend the time with God.

Back many years ago, the sabbath was a Saturday. However, the catholic church came along, and did not like to be afflicted with the Jews. So, they made a holiday on Sunday. For awhile, it remained a holiday. They then made sabbath a day of fasting. So, people enjoyed Sunday-became to loath Saturday, the sabbath. This wasn't a very good thing to do, as God said:

"If thou... call the sabbath a delight,... Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD;" Isaiah 58:13-14

Until eventually, one day, the catholics completley changed the sabbath day from saturday to sunday.

Now, I've got a poll up there, as to what day YOU think is the sabbath. However, I believe, contrary to popular belief that sunday is the seventh day, that Saturday (in harmony with gods views) is the correct sabbath day. For God said the sabbath was the 7th day-

The seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God." Exodus 20:10.

"And when the sabbath was past, ...very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre." Mark 16:1,2.

Is Saturday the last day of the week (the 7th)? Well, let me answer that question for you as well-

Was the calendar changed?

Yes. In order to keep up with the solar cycle the calendar was changed once in October 1582, but it did not alter the weekly cycle. Ten dates were omitted from the calendar following October 4, 1582. What would have been Friday, October 5, became Friday, October 15

So no. The 7th is NOT sunday. But, if you believe the sabbath day is Sunday, then go right ahead and tell me :) I am always looking for ways to keep the commandments. For God said, if you break just one commandment, you break 'em all.

#2 Coltxdoom

Coltxdoom

    Sorcerer

  • Members
  • 671 posts
  • Location:Indiana. Where corn DOES attack.

Posted 26 November 2004 - 10:53 PM

It was origionally Saturday but it was changed to Saturday..for some reason..my teacher at my religious agreed with me that it didn't matter. It was changed in the calanders and even the strict missonary chuch that is associated with my college has it on Sunday.

It doesn't matter the day, only that we celebrate it or whatever.

#3 arunma

arunma

    Physics and math maniac

  • Members
  • 3,615 posts
  • Location:University of Minnesota
  • Gender:Male

Posted 26 November 2004 - 11:17 PM

Windmill, I agree with you, the Sabbath was, and still is, Saturday. Actually, my church has services on Saturday and Sunday, and I happen to go on Saturday (not because I care what day the Sabbath is, but because the Sunday service is too early in the morning for me). There is nothing wrong with a Sunday Sabbath.

Here's a verse for you to consider: "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27).

How do you interpret this verse?

#4 arunma

arunma

    Physics and math maniac

  • Members
  • 3,615 posts
  • Location:University of Minnesota
  • Gender:Male

Posted 26 November 2004 - 11:19 PM

By the way, there's nothing wrong with reading the Bible too much. I'm sure your parents don't mind. Actually, you're fortunate to have parents who want you to read the Bible. Mine think that Christianity is a waste of time (but fortunately I'm old enough that they don't micromanage me anymore).

#5 SteveT

SteveT

    100% a Dick

  • Members
  • 5,060 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 26 November 2004 - 11:39 PM

And the commandment says every seventh day. It leaves no instruction on where to start counting. What day is the Sabbath is completely arbitrary. The only stipulation is that it must come in seven-day intervals.

Although, if you find me a verse that says where to start counting, I'll concede.

#6 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 01:10 AM

Windmill, I agree with you, the Sabbath was, and still is, Saturday. Actually, my church has services on Saturday and Sunday, and I happen to go on Saturday (not because I care what day the Sabbath is, but because the Sunday service is too early in the morning for me). There is nothing wrong with a Sunday Sabbath.

Here's a verse for you to consider: "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27).

How do you interpret this verse?

Ah ha! That verse! :lol: ah what a wonderful verse that is.
Yes, people have interpreted that verse different ways. The way I interpret that verse, is its telling us that the sabbath is made for everyone not just the Jews.
If you're telling me, that that verse means man can change the sabbath, you're compeltley wrong.
The 10 commandments wern't 10 ideas. Or 10 suggestions. No, they were commandments, clear and simple :) God COMMANDED us to keep them. No, he didn't say "you can change it" I mean, what authority do we have, to change the bible? Absolutley none.

Jesus said "Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven." Matthew 5:18-19

Also, take this verse out of the bible:

"Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good." Romans 7:12 "But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed." James 1:25

If it didn't matter what day the sabbath was, why would God make the sabbath commandment description THE LONGEST out of them all? He cleared it up for us. It was not "Keep a sabbath" But "Keep THE sabbath" God BLESSED THE SEVENTH DAY AND MADE IT HOLY. What about if God blessed your left shoe and made it holy? Could you shift the "holyness" of the day to the right shoe? No! Same with days! Why should days be any different?

Also, remember, keeping the sabbath Arunma is much, MUCH more than just going to church then going off and doing your own thing :) though I'm sure you know that.

Now...

And the commandment says every seventh day. It leaves no instruction on where to start counting. What day is the Sabbath is completely arbitrary. The only stipulation is that it must come in seven-day intervals.

Although, if you find me a verse that says where to start counting, I'll concede.

:lol: indeedy, you made one mistake. The bible does not keep every seventh day, it says keep THE seventh day.

If you want a time to start counting from, why don't we look to Jesus? Time has been kept back from when Jesus lived. Jesus, historically, kept the seventh day (Saturday) sabbath. What not better way for us to know! Jesus, himself, kept the Saturday holy. And, it shows in other verses, he even expected us to as well.

#7 Alakhriveion

Alakhriveion

    Anyone who tells you chemistry is an exact science is overthinki

  • Members
  • 4,718 posts
  • Location:Connecticut

Posted 27 November 2004 - 01:53 PM

Well, my expert opinion as someone who hasn't worked a day- or, by that, taken a day off- in his life: Does it really matter?

#8 SteveT

SteveT

    100% a Dick

  • Members
  • 5,060 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 27 November 2004 - 02:25 PM

indeedy, you made one mistake. The bible does not keep every seventh day, it says keep THE seventh day.


And once again, that gives no instruction on where to start counting. If you start counting on Thursday, for instance, Friday is the seventh day. Also, you're making quite the fuss over one article, which, I might add, doesn't exist in the Greek or Hebrew. (I could be wrong on the Hebrew part. If anyone knows, let me know.)

#9 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 03:47 PM

I'm making a huge fuss over it, because its mentioned so many times in the bible as a CXOMMANDMENT. Its just as important as not murdering. If you don't keep the 4th commandment, why not go out and murder and steal?! Go on! Go commit audultry! What you're saying there, is you don't care about gods commandments, and you feel you don't have to keep them all.

I told you, jesus kept saturday. Its in HISTORY that he kept SATURDAY so we also keep saturday.

#10 Jasi

Jasi

    Hooray for Zoidberg!

  • Members
  • 2,348 posts
  • Location:NYC
  • Gender:Female
  • United States

Posted 27 November 2004 - 04:17 PM

Wasn't it the Jews who believe that the Sabbath is on Saturday? Or am I confused?

#11 Oberon Storm

Oberon Storm

    And so it begins.

  • Members
  • 3,212 posts
  • Location:San Marcos, TX
  • Gender:Male
  • United States

Posted 27 November 2004 - 04:19 PM

I told you, jesus kept saturday. Its in HISTORY that he kept SATURDAY so we also keep saturday.

You know this for fact? How? Did they even have the concept of Saturday back then?

#12 Jasi

Jasi

    Hooray for Zoidberg!

  • Members
  • 2,348 posts
  • Location:NYC
  • Gender:Female
  • United States

Posted 27 November 2004 - 04:20 PM

We've been using the Gregorian calander for a long time now :rolleyes:

#13 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 04:32 PM

a very, VERY long time. Infact, before Jesus was born. The day "Saturday" did exsist back then.

The jews kept the saturday sabbath, and christians kept that day for hunreds of years, until the catholics for no reason changed it.

#14 Oberon Storm

Oberon Storm

    And so it begins.

  • Members
  • 3,212 posts
  • Location:San Marcos, TX
  • Gender:Male
  • United States

Posted 27 November 2004 - 04:41 PM

We've been using the Gregorian calander for a long time now :rolleyes:

Well excuse me for not knowing what days they worked and what days they sat on their ass back then. <_<

#15 Jasi

Jasi

    Hooray for Zoidberg!

  • Members
  • 2,348 posts
  • Location:NYC
  • Gender:Female
  • United States

Posted 27 November 2004 - 04:43 PM

The jews kept the saturday sabbath, and christians kept that day for hunreds of years, until the catholics for no reason changed it.


Catholics were crazy back then.

#16 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 04:52 PM

Of course they were crazy, but hey, they did it, and biblically they broke the law.

"I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plauges described in this book. And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from hiim his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book." Revelation 22:18-19

In taking away from the commandment the 7th day part (which they did) They took away from the bible...

#17 SteveT

SteveT

    100% a Dick

  • Members
  • 5,060 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 27 November 2004 - 05:29 PM

[redundancy]

Trying this again, because you're not getting it.

Yes, the Sabbath is traditionally held on Saturday. Now, the commandment follows the form, "Do things for six days, take a break the Seventh." It does not say "Saturday is herefore defined as the seventh day. You're imposing the modern concept of a week on an ancient people. That is as far as I will go without a familiarity with Ancient Hebrew calendar systems.

Now, what you're making a fuss over is not even part of the commandment itself. You're taking a very specific translation (the most literal one) and holding it to carry the weight of the authenticity of the entire Bible. Not even that, but you're focusing this translation on a single piece--taking the phrase "the seventh" as a proper noun synonomous with Saturday.

First, the word "the" was inserted there during translation and not part of the commandment at all.
Second, the passage does nothing to define what the first day is or give any other instructions on how to build your calendar. I don't recall ever seeing a proper noun referring to a day of the week in Scripture except the word "Sabbath" itself.
Third, how is "every seventh" any less accurate that "the seventh"?
Fourth. Yes, Jesus did traditionally celebrate the Sabbath on Saturday, in accordance to Jewish custom. So whoever switch it to Sunday probably broke thecommandment (by working for an extra day before honoring the Sabbath) ONE TIME. The first time. When he worked for a number other than six days between days off. Thereafter, he obeyed the commandment by working for six days, and resting the seventh. (Which is what the commandment says to do when you read the whole sentence. I mean, come on. I know literalists like to take things out of context, but at least read the whole sentence.)

#18 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 05:50 PM

We break it all the time. The 7 day week cycle has not changed. We cannot re-start the 7-day week cycle. In the 7-day week cycle, god made the 7th day the 7-day week cycles holy day.

God said the seventh day, not a seventh day.

#19 SteveT

SteveT

    100% a Dick

  • Members
  • 5,060 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:00 PM

Either "the" or "a" are perfectly accurate translations from a language with no articles.

Oh, and there are many seventh days, all of which your interperetations says are the Sabbath.

The Sabbath is the Seventh day of Creation--it's a long time ago.
The Sabbath is the Seventh day of the year --It's a month and a half away
The Sabbath is the seventh day of the month-- I hope I don't have a test.
The Sabbath is the seventh day of the week-- Saturday
The Sabbath is the seventh day after Tuesdays--That would be a Lokiday
The Sabbath is the seventh day of a 10-day week--The Sabbath issday
The Sabbath is the seventh day after Monday--Sunday, the day of the week Christ was ressurected

What the Bible DOES say about the timing of the Sabbath ist hat for every six days of work,there shall be one day of rest. That's even more literal than what you're saying.

#20 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:08 PM

NO. God created the 7-day week cycle at the creation. Remember, he rested on the 7th day.
How can that change?
Not only that, what right do we have to change the cycle that started at the begining of time? None.
It never changed. NEVER. INFACT, studies have been done which prove Saturday is the 7th day.

#21 Coltxdoom

Coltxdoom

    Sorcerer

  • Members
  • 671 posts
  • Location:Indiana. Where corn DOES attack.

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:13 PM

Windmill, give it a rest already. If you're going to debate, try and listen to others views for once?

#22 SteveT

SteveT

    100% a Dick

  • Members
  • 5,060 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:13 PM

NO. God created the 7-day week cycle at the creation. Remember, he rested on the 7th day.

You conveniently ignore one part of that story. He did six days of work before he rested. We are meant to follow his example.

I wont' even bother with making hte case for the allegory of Genesis. You wouldn't take it well.

How can that change?


Well, I suppose he could not create things for over seven days....

Not only that, what right do we have to change the cycle that started at the begining of time? None.

We don't. Which is why the first time it switched to Sunday was breaking a commandment. Switching back to Saturday would just break the commandment again.

It never changed. NEVER. INFACT, studies have been done which prove Saturday is the 7th day.


Intriguing. Care to show me said studies?

#23 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:19 PM

Windmill, give it a rest already. If you're going to debate, try and listen to others views for once?

you know, colt, I did <_< I wish you'd actually listen to mine for once yourself.

Well, I suppose he could not create things for over seven days....

Ah... so you don't believe in the 6 day creation? Sorry, I wont go into that then.


We don't. Which is why the first time it switched to Sunday was breaking a commandment. Switching back to Saturday would just break the commandment again.

No, we're breaking the commandment everytime. The 7 day week cycle is still going. Our calendars prove that. Why do you think saturday on the calendars is the 7th day? Because we did not change. The 7 day week is still going, meaning, everytime we work on the saturday, we're breaking it.

***also, I'll go get the study for you***

#24 Coltxdoom

Coltxdoom

    Sorcerer

  • Members
  • 671 posts
  • Location:Indiana. Where corn DOES attack.

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:19 PM

Does anyone know exactly WHY it was changed to Sunday?

And don't say that it was because the Catholics were crazy...lol

#25 SteveT

SteveT

    100% a Dick

  • Members
  • 5,060 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:22 PM

Because Christ was resurrected on a Sunday, giving Sunday a special significance for Christians.

#26 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:25 PM

YES.

Because the catholics didn't want to be afflicted with the jews.

Revelation also has another reason, but I wont go into it, because you'll take offense.

Because Christ was resurrected on a Sunday, giving Sunday a special significance for Christians.

That actually has no evidence to support it.
Not only that, they should've made it a holiday then.

#27 Coltxdoom

Coltxdoom

    Sorcerer

  • Members
  • 671 posts
  • Location:Indiana. Where corn DOES attack.

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:25 PM

Ok, that being put out there, how is that breaking a commandment if it's just honoring the rise of Christ?

#28 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:27 PM

Because you're breaking the sabbath, which is to rest on the 7th day (saturday) which you don't do.

#29 Selena

Selena

    Odinsdottir

  • Admin
  • 17,869 posts
  • Location:Behind you.
  • Gender:Female
  • Sweden

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:29 PM

"Rest" on the Sabbath? Even if it's Saturday OR Sunday, it's still the weekend. So technically, isn't everyone resting anyway? ;)

#30 Guest_Windmill_*

Guest_Windmill_*
  • Guests

Posted 27 November 2004 - 06:31 PM

You can always rest on sunday if you want, but you have to rest on the sabbath day, as it was commanded. Its like you're on holy ground... only you're on holy time.
Back to Controversial


  1. Zelda Legends Forums
  2. →
  3. → Controversial
  4. Privacy Policy
  5. The Rules ·
Copyright © 2025 Zelda Legends