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#1 Erimgard

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 10:36 AM

FSA and TP feature mirrors with the same backstory: They were used to seal away a dark tribe.

Nothing contradicts these two mirrors being the same, so I believe they are the same mirror, but on separate timelines.

In FSA, this mirror is stolen by Ganon, and use to "bring forth" or "spawn" Shadow Links.

Now, in TP, the mirror is said to have sealed away a tribe, and then that tribe, the Twili, play a huge role in the game.
In FSA, it would seem that this dark tribe is mentioned once, and no further background or story is given.
There is seemingly no gameplay purpose for mentioning this sealed tribe.

Unless that sealed tribe is shown.
If the Dark Mirror sealed away a dark tribe, and is capable of "bringing forth" Shadow Links, I propose that the Shadow Links themselves are this dark tribe.

Now, I don't believe there was once a tribe that was literally composed of all Shadow Links.
I don't necessarily believe the Interlopers were a full tribe, or all from one tribe. It could've been any large group of magic-wielders.

From a few quotes in FSA, we learn that this Dark Mirror reflects evil and wickedness in a person and brings it to life:

ああっ…!闇の鏡が… 何者かにうばわれているわ!
Aah…! The Mirror of Darkness… Someone has stolen it!
Ah! The Dark Mirror... Someone's stolen the Dark Mirror!

あれは、持つ者の悪しき心をうつし出し 魔物を生み出します。
That thing arouses the wickedness within the person who has it and spawns an evil being.
That mirror reveals the wickedness within a person and brings it to life.

…シャドウリンク!!
…Shadow Link!!
Shadow Link!!

あれは闇の鏡から 生まれ出たのでは?!
So, is the Mirror of Darkness what created him?!
Could he be your evil reflection, cast by the Dark Mirror?


Therefore, the Interlopers are not literally a tribe of Shadow Links, but when brought forth/spawned/created by Ganon's evil and the power of the Dark Mirror, it manifests them as Shadow Links.

Is this supported at all by TP? I believe so.

In the scene depicting the Interlopers, they are represented by...you guessed it, Shadow Links.



Though the video is highly symbolic, and should be taken with a grain of salt, I gather a few things from it:

Illia/Link turning evil represents the stories in OoT and aLttP about people fighting to find out about the Triforce, spilling blood if necessary.
Even "good" people became evil.

Interlopers being represented by Shadow Links, and one of them turning back into a "normal" Link is representative of their evil. Link represents good, so a Shadow Link is the representation of evil. Because one of them is a normal Link as well, I believe the Interlopers to be normal people with evil powers.

Summary:
The Interlopers do not necessarily have to be one specific tribe or group, but anyone who was overcome with evil and excelled at magic.
In TP they are represented by Shadow Links to show their evil.
In FSA they "become" Shadow Links as a result of the Dark Mirror reflecting the evil in Ganon's heart.

#2 MikePetersSucks

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 11:30 AM

Nothing contradicts these two mirrors being the same, so I believe they are the same mirror, but on separate timelines.


Except that they have different powers, the metaphysics of their sealing is different, they're not the same size, they look different, one mirror is explicitly said to be evil and the other is merely dangerous but still technically an item of the goddesses, one got destroyed and the other didn't, they were sealed in different places, etc. etc.

Not to mention that in Zelda Cosmology, "Dark" and "Twilight" are different.

Therefore, the Interlopers are not literally a tribe of Shadow Links, but when brought forth/spawned/created by Ganon's evil and the power of the Dark Mirror, it manifests them as Shadow Links.


That's silly. Do you know what the word "spawn" even means? Hint, "brings it to life."

The Dark Mirror literally creates new beings.

Is this supported at all by TP? I believe so.

In the scene depicting the Interlopers, they are represented by...you guessed it, Shadow Links.


Well I guess symbolism doesn't mean anything to you, huh?

What? Ilia's still alive? I call plothole, that's bullshit.

Illia/Link turning evil represents the stories in OoT and aLttP about people fighting to find out about the Triforce, spilling blood if necessary.
Even "good" people became evil.


Nitpick: It's not so much "evil" as "greed."

Summary:
The Interlopers do not necessarily have to be one specific tribe or group, but anyone who was overcome with evil and excelled at magic.
In TP they are represented by Shadow Links to show their evil.
In FSA they "become" Shadow Links as a result of the Dark Mirror reflecting the evil in Ganon's heart.


You're still grasping at straws. What about OOT's Water Temple or the final boss of AOL? HMM?

#3 LionHarted

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 02:06 PM

Except that they have different powers, the metaphysics of their sealing is different, they're not the same size, they look different, one mirror is explicitly said to be evil and the other is merely dangerous but still technically an item of the goddesses, one got destroyed and the other didn't, they were sealed in different places, etc. etc.


1) The Mirror of Twilight is used as a portal and the Dark Mirror is used to create Shadow Links but they both share the ability to reflect the evil in beings' hearts. There is no reason why either Mirror should not possess the power of the other that goes unseen within its respective game, any more than there is no reason why the Triforce should not possess the same powers throughout the entire series, despite being depicted differently.
2) The "metaphysics" of the Twilight Realm goes entirely unexplained.
3) FSA's sprites don't give an accurate representation of size.
4) The Master Sword in TP looks different than the one in OoT.
5) Both mirrors are said to be evil.
6) There are two timelines.
7) There are two timelines.

Not to mention that in Zelda Cosmology, "Dark" and "Twilight" are different.


"Dark" and "gloom," however, might as well be the same.

The Dark Mirror literally creates new beings.


The Twilight Mirror may well possess this ability as well.

Well I guess symbolism doesn't mean anything to you, huh?


It's a very interesting choice of symbolism, you must admit.

You're still grasping at straws. What about OOT's Water Temple or the final boss of AOL? HMM?


Why not? =P

#4 Erimgard

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 02:15 PM

Lex just saved me a lot of trouble. Heh.

Well I guess symbolism doesn't mean anything to you, huh?
What? Ilia's still alive? I call plothole, that's bullshit.

Apparently you missed the part where I said it's not to be taken literal, it's highly symbolic, and it should be taken with a grain of salt. ;)
I gave you my interpretations of said symbolism.

You're still grasping at straws. What about OOT's Water Temple or the final boss of AOL? HMM?

I never stated anywhere in my post that all Shadow/Dark Links were created by the Mirror of Twilight, but as Lex implied, it's technically possible.
I'm just showing the possibility of these particular Shadow Links having an Interloper connection.

Also, note that Eiji Aonuma had a lot more planned for FSA in terms of plot, but partway through production Shigeru came in and changed things up quite a bit, because he didn't want the plot to be too complex.
I highly believe that it's no coincidence that TP and FSA are virtually identical in their overall plot. To me, things like the Interlopers and the Mirror of Twilight are an expansion on the ideas Eiji started on for FSA, but had to abandon at Shigeru's urging.

#5 CID Farwin

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 02:37 PM

I may not agree with everything here, but

To me, things like the Interlopers and the Mirror of Twilight are an expansion on the ideas Eiji started on for FSA, but had to abandon at Shigeru's urging.


That at least I can agree with.

#6 Jumbie

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 04:11 PM

Excellent thread, Erimgard!

FSA and TP feature mirrors with the same backstory: They were used to seal away a dark tribe.

Nothing contradicts these two mirrors being the same, so I believe they are the same mirror, but on separate timelines.

First of all, I agree.

I don't necessarily believe the Interlopers were a full tribe, or all from one tribe. It could've been any large group of magic-wielders.

Well, in Japanese the magic wielders are never called a tribe, but constantly referred to as a clan or family.

Now, in TP, the mirror is said to have sealed away a tribe, and then that tribe, the Twili, play a huge role in the game.
In FSA, it would seem that this dark tribe is mentioned once, and no further background or story is given.
There is seemingly no gameplay purpose for mentioning this sealed tribe.

Unless that sealed tribe is shown.

Up to here, exactly! But then comes where we differ. Let me use this opportunity to present a theory that I haven't openly spoken about before.

Am I the only one who noticed that a group of magic wielders does visually appear in FSA, complete with their dark cloaks, a strong affinity to darkness, and a presumed inclination towards evil?
The sudden appearance of the mages is never really explained, and the mentioned clan of darkness is never elaborated on. So it only makes sense to connect these two unsolved issues to one, thereby restoring some inner closure to the game's plot.

In Japanese FSA, there's no universal name given to the mages, they are referred to with a variety of words for "magic users". One of them, found at Death Mountain Foothills, says:

フォフォフォ…。 お若いの、巨人の群れに お困りかな…?
Ho ho ho… Young ones, troubled by the crowd of giants, are you?

Oh ho ho ho… Such youth… Troubled by the giants, are you?

この世には 我ら魔導師によって 強大な魔法が かけられた 2種類のメダルがある。
In this world there are two types of medallion on which we magic wielders have applied mighty sorcery.

We magic users have enchanted two types of medallion.

それは 一瞬にして、凶悪な魔物の姿を変えたり、消したりする魔法…。
This magic instantly alters the shape of brutal monsters or kills them…

These medallions instantly alter the shape of an evil presence or make it vanish.

そのうちの ひとつが そこの宝箱に しまってある。
One of these is in that treasure chest there.

One of these medallions is in that treasure chest there.

ワシが 魔法をかけたものじゃ。よかったら お使いなされ…。
I enchanted it. You may use it if you like…

It's one that I enchanted myself. You may use it if you like.

Compare that mage's "mighty sorcery", 強大な魔法, to the wording
used by Lanayru, "powerful sorcery", 強力な魔力.

Pretty similar, and just a little different. This tiny difference is comparable to the tiny difference between FSA's 闇の一族 (Clan of Darkness) and TP's 影の一族 (Clan of Shadow), which is totally due to the games' focuses on either darkness or shadow, and delivers no reason for them to be two different clans.

Also, the mages don't hail from "this world" (この世), and the same wording is used in TP when they differentiate between "this world" and "the otherworld" (which is in truth the Shadow World).

Now, the obvious objection to my theory will be that the Twilis cannot live in the light world. However, this is not necessarily true.
Just because Midna prefers to remain a shadow there, and suffers damage once exposed to one of the greatest sources of light, this does not mean the Twilis couldn't dwell in the harsh light if they just protected themselves with the cloaks they're already wearing anyway.

Not long ago, I translated the first conversation between Zant and Midna:

いくら望んでも、今の世界では お前は 決して交わることはできぬ影にすぎぬ
No matter how much you may desire otherwise, in the world as it is now, you will never be more than a shadow that cannot mingle.

No matter how much you may desire otherwise, you will never be more than a shadow in their world. You cannot consort with their kind!

Notes:
- "Traitor of the shadows" shows how shadows can be used as a collective term for the Clan of Shadow. That metaphoric sense is important for further down.
- While he still does say Midna cannot mingle in the Light World due to being a shadow, this may be meant in said metaphoric sense, because the word for mingle refers to social interaction, which she as one of the hated Shadow people will never be able to. Just my interpretation, but a valid one.

Even if one's personal problem with this quote is too great to overcome - in spite of the justification I gave in the notes -, one really has to consider that in FSA the situation is that Vaati goes around spreading darkness over the land. This is exactly what the mages welcome, and the one and only reason why they praise Link for having released Vaati. The Village episode tells us that the mages are not evil, thus they cannot be applauding Vaati for his evil nature, but rather for making "the world a better place for our kind", to use their own words.

Well, I certainly don't expect people to like my theory or reasoning (apart maybe from Lex and Erimgard), but at least you can see now that I didn't sympathize with the two mirrors being the same without any reason. I do have this waterproof theory about who the clan of darkness is. The thing I can't explain is the role and nature of the Dark World in FSA, but none of us really can, so that's not my flaw.

Except that they have different powers

Similar powers. And what Lex said.

the metaphysics of their sealing is different

Only by hearsay.

they're not the same size

2D versus 3D.

they look different

Not true.

one mirror is explicitly said to be evil and the other is merely dangerous but still technically an item of the goddesses

In FSA the goddesses aren't mentioned, so "evil" may be synonymous for "dangerous".

one got destroyed and the other didn't

That's why FSA is in a separate timeline from TP.

they were sealed in different places

Not necessarily. The Temple of Darkness could easily be the Execution Place, as it's located close to FSA's desert. Technically, in the level map, the temple isn't even close to the forest, in spite of what the maiden may say.

Not to mention that in Zelda Cosmology, "Dark" and "Twilight" are different.

It is Mirror of Darkness versus Mirror of Gloom.

#7 Erimgard

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 04:23 PM

Thank you, Jumbie.

Well, in Japanese the magic wielders are never called a tribe, but constantly referred to as a clan or family.

Excellent, reinforces the point that it isn't a specific tribe.

And your points about the magic users are very interesting. My only objection is that in FSA only mentions the tribe being sealed off, not their past of dark magic. Because nothing is mentioned of their past, I'm not sure if it was originally intended for there to be a connection between the Dark Tribe and the magic users.

However, as I stated in response to "MikePetersSucks", I think a lot of TP was based on the concepts that Eiji could not use in FSA. I think it's possible that the Twili/Interlopers were developed by mixing the backstory of the Dark Mirror and the magic users of FSA together. Representing the Interlopers as Shadow Links then helps solidify a connection between the two Mirrors.

If FSA's magic users=Interlopers though, how were they able to escape the Twilight Realm/Mirror?

#8 Jumbie

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 04:44 PM

And your points about the magic users are very interesting. My only objection is that in FSA only mentions the tribe being sealed off, not their past of dark magic. Because nothing is mentioned of their past, I'm not sure if it was originally intended for there to be a connection between the Dark Tribe and the magic users.

I don't know that, but as you say, it could have originally been intended to be clarified, but now in the final game, players who also know TP need to make that stretch on their own...

If FSA's magic users=Interlopers though, how were they able to escape the Twilight Realm/Mirror?

Well, Ganondorf's using the mirror might mean that as a side effect, the portal to the Twilight Realm opened up.

Btw, do you remember that huge dark stone cube?
I mean... the one in FSA's Temple of Darkness, which the Deku Scrubs wanted to turn into a statue of Ganon... ;)

Edited by Jumbie, 23 May 2008 - 04:53 PM.


#9 Hero of Legend

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 05:00 PM

Now, the obvious objection to my theory will be that the Twilis cannot live in the light world. However, this is not necessarily true.

Just because Midna prefers to remain a shadow there, and suffers damage once exposed to one of the greatest sources of light, this does not mean the Twilis couldn't dwell in the harsh light if they just protected themselves with the cloaks they're already wearing anyway.

I'm not saying you're totally wrong here, but the fact that Midna always appears in physical form after she has received Zelda's power tells me her previous existence as a shadow was not entirely a matter of preference. This of course does not hamper the dual meaning of Zant's words.

As for your theory about the Dark Tribe/Mirror of Darkness, I like it. I don't think the Shadow Link's are members of the Dark Tribe, so the Mages are a logical choice - of course, they don't need to be related to the mirror at all.

#10 Jumbie

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 05:09 PM

I'm not saying you're totally wrong here, but the fact that Midna always appears in physical form after she has received Zelda's power tells me her previous existence as a shadow was not entirely a matter of preference. This of course does not hamper the dual meaning of Zant's words.

I meant she prefers being a shadow because then the light doesn't hurt her. Also, Midna as an imp lacks that protective cloak I mentioned.
My message was unclear, I just wanted to say there are ways for Twilis to exist in the light, if they do it right. Like Zant, who always protects his skin under a helmet and long garments while in the light world.

As for your theory about the Dark Tribe/Mirror of Darkness, I like it. I don't think the Shadow Link's are members of the Dark Tribe, so the Mages are a logical choice - of course, they don't need to be related to the mirror at all.

Not by what FSA alone tells us, no, but TP enables us to fix an unsolved plot line in FSA.

Edited by Jumbie, 23 May 2008 - 05:37 PM.


#11 Chaltab

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 05:11 PM

Btw, do you remember that huge dark stone cube?
I mean... the one in FSA's Temple of Darkness, which the Deku Scrubs wanted to turn into a statue of Ganon... ;)


Whoa... O_O

As for the overall topic, I definitely agree with the original poster. The mirrors are too similar and the back stories too identical not to have some connection. Since I'm a single-timeliner, I can't say they're the same mirror, but I presume that the Dark Mirror of FSA is an attempted reforging of the original. The fact that it's also located in a desert temple in the Western Part of Hyrule, just like the Twilight mirror was located in a desert Prison in the Western Part of Hyrule is pretty telling. The insight with the vision being of Dark Links is also pretty durn convincing.

Even the 'Dark World' of FSA is very similar to the spread of Twilight from the first half of Twilight Princess, and the reason Link can't see it in FSA without a portal is the same reason none of the townsfolk could in Twilight Princess: Nobody knows they're in it without special magic like Link's blessing in TP or the pearls in FSA.

Edited by Chaltab, 23 May 2008 - 05:12 PM.


#12 Hero of Legend

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 05:30 PM

I meant she prefers being a shadow because then the light doesn't hurt her. Also, Midna as an imp lacks that protective cloak I mentioned.
My message was unclear, I just wanted to say there are ways for Twilis to exist in the light, if they do it right. Like Zant, who always protects his skin under a helmet and long garments while in the light world.

You're right, that makes a whole lot of sense.

Granted, I always assumed Zant was protected by Ganondorf's power just like Midna was by Zelda. Come to think of it, there are some interesting parallels here; Ganondorf and Zant are both pretty much evil usurper kings while the princesses are the real deal – it supports the idea I have that Zelda, more so than Link, is the 'antithesis' of Ganondorf.

#13 Erimgard

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 06:50 PM

Even the 'Dark World' of FSA is very similar to the spread of Twilight from the first half of Twilight Princess, and the reason Link can't see it in FSA without a portal is the same reason none of the townsfolk could in Twilight Princess: Nobody knows they're in it without special magic like Link's blessing in TP or the pearls in FSA.

Yes, I believe the Twilight Curtain was based off the FSA Dark World as well. It's not one of my strong points of debate, so I didn't really broach the subject though.
FSA's Dark World doesn't seem to function the same as the Dark World of aLttP, so I think this may be something else Shigeru influenced. If he wanted to sever any ties of FSA as the IW [as implied by unused bits of text referencing sages and such] he may have been the reason the Dark World of FSA is apparently not the same as that of aLttP.
Thus, when Twilight Princess came out, the Twilight Curtain evolved from FSA's Dark World.

#14 CID Farwin

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 10:06 PM

Granted, I always assumed Zant was protected by Ganondorf's power just like Midna was by Zelda. Come to think of it, there are some interesting parallels here; Ganondorf and Zant are both pretty much evil usurper kings while the princesses are the real deal – it supports the idea I have that Zelda, more so than Link, is the 'antithesis' of Ganondorf.

Hm, that would work, as you can have games with Link and no Zelda/Ganon.

Btw, do you remember that huge dark stone cube?
I mean... the one in FSA's Temple of Darkness, which the Deku Scrubs wanted to turn into a statue of Ganon... wink.gif

Guwha? I don't remember that (or really much of FSA, for that matter) but WOW!

As I said, the mirrors may not be the same, but they might. I'm comfortable with just that they based stuff in TP off of the stuff in FSA.

#15 NM87

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 11:23 PM

The Interlopers do not necessarily have to be one specific tribe or group, but anyone who was overcome with evil and excelled at magic.


That’s heavy. I cannot think of any real objections to this claim. Great theory. The only thing I don’t understand is why the function of the mirror demands it to be in two separate timelines. Can Ganon not steal the Mirror and use it for evil purposes after TP, which would be the events of FSA?

Illia/Link turning evil represents the stories in OoT and aLttP about people fighting to find out about the Triforce, spilling blood if necessary.


TP sounds like ALTTP’s true prequel more and more, day by day.

#16 Erimgard

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 11:30 PM

The Interlopers do not necessarily have to be one specific tribe or group, but anyone who was overcome with evil and excelled at magic.


That’s heavy. I cannot think of any real objections to this claim. Great theory. The only thing I don’t understand is why the function of the mirror demands it to be in two separate timelines. Can Ganon not steal the Mirror and use it for evil purposes after TP, which would be the events of FSA?

Their function is not the reason they are on opposite timelines.
If the mirrors are the same, FSA and TP can't coexist.
If FSA precedes TP, then TP's quote about the Sages standing guard over the mirror since ancient times is false.
If TP precedes FSA, the mirror is destroyed in TP and cannot appear in FSA.

TP sounds like ALTTP’s true prequel more and more, day by day.

Keep in mind though, the story of the Interlopers is pre-OoT, so it has no affect over which timeline aLttP falls on.

#17 NM87

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 11:46 PM

If TP precedes FSA, the mirror is destroyed in TP and cannot appear in FSA.

Well, the princess spoke truly: as long as that mirror's around, we could meet
again...
Link...
I...
See you later...

Ya never know... :whistle:

Of course, this proves absolutely nothing, but...if the Master Sword can be reforged in OOX...then maybe, just maybe...

#18 Erimgard

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 11:48 PM

Ya never know... :whistle:

Of course, this proves absolutely nothing, but...if the Master Sword can be reforged in OOX...then maybe, just maybe...

Haha, there's always a possibility...it's Zelda. But with that dramatic scene of the mirror's destruction, I'd say the chances are slim.

#19 LionHarted

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 11:51 PM

Of course, this proves absolutely nothing, but...if the Master Sword can be reforged in OOX...then maybe, just maybe...


Truuuuue.

However, there's a precedent for sacred blades being reforged, whereas there isn't a precedent for cursed objects that serve as portals to other worlds being re-created.

#20 NM87

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Posted 23 May 2008 - 11:59 PM

Guys, ya gotta believe…believe in the magic…of the legend.

#21 Erimgard

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 12:00 AM

Guys, ya gotta believe…believe in the magic…of the legend.

If I saw evidence implying the Mirror has been rebuilt, I'd believe. But I'm not going to change my timeline over something that has absolutely no supporting evidence.

#22 NM87

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 12:10 AM

Guys, ya gotta believe…believe in the magic…of the legend.

If I saw evidence implying the Mirror has been rebuilt, I'd believe. But I'm not going to change my timeline over something that has absolutely no supporting evidence.

Chill out, I'm not saying anything. Although, putting FSA on a timeline seperate from TP, means putting it alongside WW. Which means Hyrule is...thats right. Gotta beleive!

#23 LionHarted

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 12:36 AM

Although, putting FSA on a timeline seperate from TP, means putting it alongside WW. Which means Hyrule is...thats right. Gotta beleive!


Well, if you consider that FSA has completely different symbology from OoT (look at the Hyrulian crest in FSA, for instance), then that might be evidence of a different kingdom...

#24 NM87

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 12:55 AM

Well, if you consider that FSA has completely different symbology from OoT (look at the Hyrulian crest in FSA, for instance), then that might be evidence of a different kingdom...

It could definitely work that way, but it could also work a different way. We know that language and legends were lost over the span of many years between ALTTP and the IW, so in the child timeline, is still possible for there to be different symbols in FSA, which in my theory, takes place at the end of the timeline.

#25 Erimgard

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 10:10 AM

Guys, ya gotta believe…believe in the magic…of the legend.

If I saw evidence implying the Mirror has been rebuilt, I'd believe. But I'm not going to change my timeline over something that has absolutely no supporting evidence.

Chill out, I'm not saying anything.

What about my post implied I lost my cool? o.0

Although, putting FSA on a timeline seperate from TP, means putting it alongside WW. Which means Hyrule is...thats right. Gotta beleive!

Either a new Hyrule was found, or the Koroks created one big island. Both are hinted in the games, thus, I "believe in the legend" ;)

#26 Jumbie

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 10:50 AM

Illia/Link turning evil represents the stories in OoT and aLttP about people fighting to find out about the Triforce, spilling blood if necessary.

TP sounds like ALTTP’s true prequel more and more, day by day.

Not helped by this particular fact. TP referencing the fierce war just like ALttP may as well mean that ALttP and TP are in parallel timelines.

if the Master Sword can be reforged in OOX...then maybe, just maybe...

And for what purpose exactly would the Hyrulians go against common sense and Midna's decision?

Although, putting FSA on a timeline seperate from TP, means putting it alongside WW.

Not compulsorily. We can open as many timelines as we want, it's a free world. ;)

Well, if you consider that FSA has completely different symbology from OoT (look at the Hyrulian crest in FSA, for instance), then that might be evidence of a different kingdom...

Or a different graphics style.

#27 LionHarted

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 11:11 AM

Or a different graphics style.


The same graphics style is used in TMC, and TMC shares much of OoT's symbology. I'm actually reconsidering an earlier placement of TMC, possibly after OoT and before TWW. (Based in part on Minister Potho appearing in the portrait in TWW's Hyrule Castle.)

#28 Jumbie

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 12:18 PM

The same graphics style is used in TMC, and TMC shares much of OoT's symbology.

FSA mixed up the graphics styles of ALttP, FS, and TWW. The Knight's Crest, which I assume you referred to as FSA's Hyrule crest, appeared in TWW alongside the usual Hyrule bird.

I'm actually reconsidering an earlier placement of TMC, possibly after OoT and before TWW. (Based in part on Minister Potho appearing in the portrait in TWW's Hyrule Castle.)

This character can be reincarnated just like all the others.
If you consider moving TMC, why not simply put it before OoT which is its intended placement?

Edited by Jumbie, 24 May 2008 - 12:18 PM.


#29 Chaltab

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 12:26 PM

if the Master Sword can be reforged in OOX...then maybe, just maybe...

And for what purpose exactly would the Hyrulians go against common sense and Midna's decision?


Who said it was the Hyrulians who reforged the mirror? It could have been anyone with magic skills. Koume and Kotake, for example.

#30 LionHarted

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Posted 24 May 2008 - 12:29 PM

FSA mixed up the graphics styles of ALttP, FS, and TWW. The Knight's Crest, which I assume you referred to as FSA's Hyrule crest, appeared in TWW alongside the usual Hyrule bird.


Curious.

Although I still maintain interest in the complete absence of said "usual Hyrule bird" in FSA.

This character can be reincarnated just like all the others.


Certainly.

I'm simply citing TWW as the only other time he appears.

If you consider moving TMC, why not simply put it before OoT which is its intended placement?


Because I frankly see nothing about TMC, besides vague Capcom-written narration at the end, that suggests it to be first.




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