This is the first time I've posted a theory of my own, mainly because my private theories have always been too close to other people's. Just yesterday, however, my thoughts on the timeline led me to the idea of having multiple continuities of Zelda, an idea sort-of well known to the outside world, but considered disgusting within Zelda Storyline.
Let me start by saying that I expect quite a bit of opposition on this. I've read Davo's article against this concept, as well as a few of TSA's rants on the subject, and I agree with them completely. I still hold that all the games will one day fit together. Until that day, I feel that the current mess of Zelda games has forced me into this. If you want a single continuity, add them together.
Four Sword Continuity
TMC backstory
TMC
FS backstory
FS
FSA
Master Sword Continuities
Aonuma Miyamoto
OoT-MM OoT- (MM)
TWW ALttP
Navitrackers LA
(If you feel like counting it)
"Original Continuity"
AoL backstory
LoZ
AoL
Oracles
Placement Pending: Zelda GC 2005
Four Swords DS
Notes:
The continuities are grouped by similarities, references to past legends, and so on. The Four Sword Continuity is the only one with the Four Sword (Unfortunately, I decided that the Four Sword-ALttP ending must be scrapped as an Easter egg, as I can't conceive of how it would work out). In this timeline, the Links have this uncanny tendency to already know the princess from childhood. No Master Sword or goddesses are mentioned here, nor any Sacred Realm. This is the only timeline with Vaati.
The next continuity I have split in two by creators, though if you wish to add them together for a Combined Master Sword Continuity, go ahead. There are a few reasons as to why I split it: ALttP and TWW both seem to stem from the Adult Ending (with a different interpretation for each. TWW seems to focus on the Hero of Time aspect of OoT, while ALttP disregards this to focus on the Seven Sages and the Seal on Ganon), though it doesn't make sense for one to occur after the other. ALttP can't come first for obvious reasons (the huge link between OoT and TWW) and I don't think it can really follow TWW, due to the finality of Hyrule, Ganon, and the Master Sword in TWW's ending.
The Master Sword is the central item to these timelines, and it carries with it the infamous three-jewel lock in all of the main games. These continuities are the only ones with Sages, the Sacred Realm, and the goddesses. The Aonuma timeline has the only heroes with titles, while the Miyamoto timeline has an ocarina in every game. Both have more of a focus on Ganon's humanity as opposed to his monster form (though the Aonuma continuity moreso).
At first I questioned whether to put MM in the Miyamoto timeline, mainly because it is an Aonuma game, but since the difference in the two continuities is after the Adult Ending, you may place it there as it doesn't affect anything.
The final continuity has no "main sword." The Master Sword exists in Oracles, but whether it is an Easter egg or not is debatable. Both arguments are solid, but either way, my theory is not concerned with the controversy. The way that both Links encounter Impa is similar in this one, and the least is known about these two.
Each of these timelines seems to have a different interpretation of Ganon. In the Original Continuity, he is presented only as a monster (to my knowledge), though Twinrova exists, so he may have been a Gerudo at some point. In the Master Sword Continuities, he is presented as an evil man that becomes a monster. In the Four Sword Continuity, he is an ancient demon that a hero defeated. Later, he is reborn in a Gerudo man with an evil disposition. Finally, he claims an ancient relic that returns him to his demonic form, and probably awakens his old memories.
The Triforce is different in each of these as well. In the Four Sword timeline, it is given to Hyrule by the Minish. It may have been divinely created, but that has not been given to us. In the Master Sword timeline, it has been lying in the Sacred Realm since Creation, until Ganondorf gets ahold of it. In the Original timeline, it is a magical treasure of the kingdom, with no origin. Also, each continuity has the Triforce broken once, only to be united again (it hasn't be reunited in Four Swords yet, but it's only a matter of time).
I'm not one of those morons who thinks that Zelda games all contain the same story, retold as different legends. All of these have very different stories. I'm beginning to think that Zelda is a few different stories, each with the same characters, but different histories and rules. Kind of like how what may be a boss in one FF game may be a summon in the next. For the most part, this theory eliminates the recycling of characters. All three have only one Ganon, one Malon and Talon, and so on, never repeating characters within one timeline. Exceptions: Link and Zelda, for obvious reasons. Tingle, though I believe that the games explain this away. There are two Impas in the Original timeline, which I find is unavoidable. This also explains the Oracles. In the Master Sword timeline, Din, Nayru, and Farore are the names of the creator deities. In the Original, they are oracles, and they are mentioned in the Four Sword continuity, in TMC.
About Oracle placement: Many people place Oracles after ALttP, and I've never understood why. In this theory, the only reason would be because the Triforce behaves the same way (it talks). The LoZ remake was suppose to be another Oracle game. That and the sword and Ganon issues makes me think that this is the best place for them.
Many of you may say that this is to clean and simple. You may say that it's no fun (though I could argue that our theories aren't meant to be fun, they are meant to be true). You may say that I'm taking the easy way out. You'd be right. Please note that I do not like this, but I have devised it to keep me sane. The current issue of the Zelda timeline is a confusing mess. I want nothing more than for Aonuma to fix everything (though it could take ten games), or for that document to hold all the answers. Unfortunately we don't have that. This way, all that I have to fanfic is how Ganon gets the two remaining Triforce pieces for ALttP, while otherwise I would have to fanfic darned near everything. I realize that this contradicts many statements from the creators, but then again, don't almost all theories these days?
Davo? TSA? I await your scrutiny.
The dreaded multiple continuities
Started by
Guest_TanakaBros06_*
, Dec 22 2004 09:14 PM
12 replies to this topic
#2
Guest_BlackHawkA100_*
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Posted 22 December 2004 - 09:40 PM
Nice, I think that the way you've separated the games makes sense considering the similarities in each. You've taken evidence from each game and placed them together based on that which is something I haven't seen before on these boards (then again, I haven't been here for a terribly long time either) I like it. I will admit however that I don't know enough about most of the games to truly back up or argue against the theory and therefore my opinion really doesn't mean a ton. I'll have to look up all this stuff and then look at your theory again.
Also, it's difficult for me to look at the list of games and solidly tell which one goes where, they're all bunched up so that the heading doesn't match up with the games beneath.
Also, it's difficult for me to look at the list of games and solidly tell which one goes where, they're all bunched up so that the heading doesn't match up with the games beneath.
#3
Guest_TanakaBros06_*
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Posted 22 December 2004 - 09:44 PM
Thanks for pointing that out. It wasn't supposed to look like that, but I guess the forum did that when I posted. I'll fix it.
#4
Doopliss
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Posted 22 December 2004 - 11:07 PM
I meant that Zelda sent Link to a period of time before the events of OoT happened.
(Sorry, wrong thread.)
(Sorry, wrong thread.)
#5
MikePetersSucks
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Posted 25 December 2004 - 07:56 PM
One Word: Nice! 
*applauds*
This could be possible, but... >.>; *hopes for magical crossover game that links the realities*
*applauds*This could be possible, but... >.>; *hopes for magical crossover game that links the realities*
#6
Wolf O'Donnell
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Posted 27 December 2004 - 09:47 AM
This is the first time I've posted a theory of my own, mainly because my private theories have always been too close to other people's. Just yesterday, however, my thoughts on the timeline led me to the idea of having multiple continuities of Zelda, an idea sort-of well known to the outside world, but considered disgusting within Zelda Storyline.
Given the evidence I don't blame you for creating a multiple continuities theory. It is, as of the current time and status, the best one we've got. No single continuity theory can hope to make sense with the Zelda franchise as it currently stands.
I still hold that all the games will one day fit together.
Unfortunately, I have qualms about that particular statement. It all concerns how much control Capcom has over the new games its been creating, as Capcom is notorious for continuity errors like the huge error in the Resident Evil series (with a dead character coming back to life using a plot device that couldn't possibly have existed at the time of him dying), and the continuity error in the Megaman X/Zero series.
I feel, however, your continuities are pretty much okay... except that Link's Awakening should really feature after Oracles.
The evidence is as follows:
LA takes place after Link goes off to faraway lands on a boat. In LA he has already defeated Ganon.
In Oracles, during the ending sequence, we see Link going off on a boat just like the one featured in the LA opening sequence. He is also seen sailing off from a coastline where Hyrule Castle can clearly be seen in the background, which suggests that he left Hyrule in Oracles and went on a journey between Oracles and LA.
The placement of LA after ALttP is assumed because one of the Final Boss forms is something that has similar attacks to Agahnim. However, if you look carefully at the shape that is not the shape of Agahnim.
Just as important is that in Oracles, you get two bosses that have similar attacks to Agahnim and one that looks almost similar to the wizard himself. This explains the Agahnim form of the Nightmares.
Also, many of the other monsters that appear in Oracles also reappear in LA. Seeing as LA is a Dream World made from things that the Windfish has seen (which might explain the telephones) and things that Link has seen in his travels.
Everything else, however, seems to fit perfectly.
I must however, repeat myself and state that I doubt that the mess will ever be solved as I doubt Nintendo will ever be concerned about continuity errors.
#7
TSA
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Posted 28 December 2004 - 12:02 AM
Legend of the Fairy.
Explain in detail how this story can exist if there are multiple timelines...and please dont' say it is just an Easter Egg.
Explain in detail how this story can exist if there are multiple timelines...and please dont' say it is just an Easter Egg.
#8
coinilius
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Posted 28 December 2004 - 02:06 AM
Once again, I feel I have to preface my comments with a 'I'm not supporting any timeline theory here' disclaimer, since they do not necesarily reflect my thinking on the matter...
But TSA, a way the legend of the Fairy could work with multiple timelines is (OoT/MM - OoT/tWW) is that - Termina is in a parallel dimension to Hyrule anyway; who's to say that the Terminian Tingle didn't find his way to the other Hyrule somehow. Dimensional transmigration is required anyway (Termina to Hyrule), so it's just one one more step added in
But TSA, a way the legend of the Fairy could work with multiple timelines is (OoT/MM - OoT/tWW) is that - Termina is in a parallel dimension to Hyrule anyway; who's to say that the Terminian Tingle didn't find his way to the other Hyrule somehow. Dimensional transmigration is required anyway (Termina to Hyrule), so it's just one one more step added in
#9
Wolf O'Donnell
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Posted 29 December 2004 - 12:48 PM
Legend of the Fairy.
Explain in detail how this story can exist if there are multiple timelines...and please dont' say it is just an Easter Egg.
You'll first have to explain to me what the Heck the "Legend of the Fairy" is. I've heard about it, but I have no idea what on Hyrule it is. I'm not priveleged enough to be able to buy a GC-GBA adaptor.
However, from Coinilius' statement, I can guess that it has something to do with MM and Tingle. Just because in one version of Hyrule, Ganondorf never manages to takeover Hyrule, doesn't mean that Tingle doesn't exist in Termina.
Tingle's existence is independent of Link's existence, unless the Tingle in Termina happens to be an Alternate Version of Link. (Now that would be scary!)
With the Multiple Universe Hypothesis, there is the basis that there are an infinite number of Universes with an infinite number of outcomes for each and every one of each Link's actions.
Therefore, there will be the one Universe in which all the games in the Series all exist in the same Universe and in the same timeline, but without the discrepancies that currently exist between the games. In another Universe, the events of some other games will not occur.
Current evidence points towards both Single and Multiple Universe Hypotheses. Inconsistencies and contradictions in back stories of the games so far suggests that the Single Universe Hypothesis will not work without an insane volume of fanfiction injected in for good measure. Just take a look at your own attempts, you've had to assume so many things and thus, inject some fanfiction ideas into your timeline attempt.
As I've stated before, however, as the way it stands only the Multiple Universe Hypothesis works best and that's only because the time travel aspect injected paradoxes that made a Single Universe Hypothesis logically impossible. The Multiple Universe Hypothesis gets rid of all fanfiction.
Yes, it seems as if the Zelda Team are aiming for a Single Timeline, but I doubt they'll ever be able to solve all the discrepancies unless they rerelease all the games and edit out inconvenient contradictions.
As far as I'm concerned, I think they have a far more important job to do, and that is to make a decent game. To Heck with a back story that tries to satisfy fans' curiosities about the Zelda timeline.
#10
Hana-Nezumi
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Posted 29 December 2004 - 03:00 PM
I don't know what the legend of the fairy is either. can someone please clear this up?
#11
Zythe
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Posted 29 December 2004 - 04:21 PM
The Legend of the Fairy is a tale about Tingle sealed in Tower of the Gods in TWW which you can only get with help from 2p Tingle. It says that Tingle helped the Hero out (MM) and ever since then on a certain island when men reach middle age they dress up like fairies and go on a quest.
#12
FDL
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Posted 30 December 2004 - 09:50 PM
Unfortunately, I have qualms about that particular statement. It all concerns how much control Capcom has over the new games its been creating, as Capcom is notorious for continuity errors like the huge error in the Resident Evil series (with a dead character coming back to life using a plot device that couldn't possibly have existed at the time of him dying), and the continuity error in the Megaman X/Zero.
Very good point.
#13
Wolf O'Donnell
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Posted 01 January 2005 - 12:04 PM
The Legend of the Fairy is a tale about Tingle sealed in Tower of the Gods in TWW which you can only get with help from 2p Tingle. It says that Tingle helped the Hero out (MM) and ever since then on a certain island when men reach middle age they dress up like fairies and go on a quest.
So, what this Legend says is one of two things:
A). Termina does not exist in a parallel universe to Hyrule.
or
B). Link must have left the parallel universe Termina exists in and talked about his exploits there, possibly to the Royal Court (which possibly explains the statue to him that exists in Hyrule Castle - TWW).
However, as far I as see, the Legend of the Fairy, if not an easter egg that must be ignored, is something that merely messes up any attempts to create a single timeline.
(What a strange concept of fairies those Tingle-esque people have).
